MOTOR Mag- SRT-8 vs HSV Senator vs FPV BFGT

WASP · 13-05-2006, 09:37 PM

MOTOR Mag- SRT-8 vs HSV Senator vs FPV BFGT

Was just having a quick flick of the mag while out and about and noticed this comparison and was surprised (and delighted) that the BFGT was the overall winner. From what I read they thought the GT did most things better than the others, but the interior spec was not quite in the same league as the others being the cheapest of the lot (A GT-P would have been more appropriate). They did say that despite the GT being the best out of the lot, the SRT-8 was the favorite, I imagine due to its big cube performance and the novelty factor being that it’s something different.

Anyone had a read and seen the article?

parawolf · 13-05-2006, 09:54 PM

Haven't read it... but I could understand why the SRT8 was the favourite. Bigger Cubes more likely means better low down torque - something the GT's are renowned for lacking.

But a solid result from your report.

Lukeyson · 13-05-2006, 09:56 PM

wierd they did use a gt, as in last months mag they said the SRT-8 was tackling the Senator and GT-P

Mark351 · 13-05-2006, 10:15 PM

No auto GT-Ps were available, so they up-specced a GT - just missing the better brakes and interior.

The GT did get the gong, the last quote about the SRT-8 was everyone fighting over the keys to take it home. After testing so many HSV and FPVs, would you blame them? I'd be after the keys too!

**Polyal** · 13-05-2006, 10:18 PM

Just got the mag then but haven't read the article, will be interesting to see how they rate the SRT.

Did they mention that a GTP would have increased the gap?

WASP · 13-05-2006, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Did they mention that a GTP would have increased the gap?

Only maybe marginally. As it was the GT out-braked the lot of them so it was only really an interior thing. Besides the seats there's not much difference is there? They also made the comment along the lines of "You would swear the GT was 200kg lighter than the others around the corners" or something like that.

I think it's comparo's like this that makes me think that with the FPV package the way it is these days, if they only would supercharge the BOSS engine from factory nothing much would touch it (within the same category). Damn ADR,...let the GTHO go thru..(Opps did I say that?

: )

ReVd_uP · 13-05-2006, 10:42 PM

althought it would be awesome, i dont think s/c would be nessasary, just look at some of the boss290's getting around with just simple bolts ons, it would be nice for the GT to be a factory 12 sec stormer likes its little(?) F6 stablemate

Noddy · 14-05-2006, 12:15 AM

Although it will probably never happen i agree with cdaa, a went for a run in a djr320 with the twin screw blower on it. It was frighteningly quick, easily the quickest v8 streetcar i have been in. There is alot that i like with regards to the Chrysler but i think id still prefer to be driving a gtp.

FPV · 14-05-2006, 12:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDAA

Damn ADR,...let the GTHO go thru..(Opps did I say that?

: )

Thats a huge insight into why we havent seen one. I wonder what ADR it is in conflict with, bonnet clearance? If its in conflict with a ADR then i guess we won't see anything until the orion. Unless they are working on trying to pass it through, hopefully thats the case, cause im sure HSV will have something in the bag for this year.

On a different note, i find it hard to believe the HSV senator had better build quality. Is the senator really a huge difference between it and the lesser models. In a previous wheels magazine with the GT-P vs Senator, they said the Senator had a more upmarket ambience.

Big Mike · 14-05-2006, 01:50 AM

GTHO you say... I haven't researched this, but wasn't there an F-150 Lightening or something along those lines in USA with - and I'm only guessing here - a supercharged 5.4 3V Boss motor factory?

Full Spectrum · 14-05-2006, 02:58 AM

A very strange comparison, The Senator is the softy in the HSV line-up, And the GT is the base FPV V8 sedan. Up against a Heavy hitter with double big mac, And a rapper to say so;).
It's a little like having a BA GT and VY Clubsport Vs the VY GTS.

outback_ute · 14-05-2006, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathXR

The GT did get the gong, the last quote about the SRT-8 was everyone fighting over the keys to take it home.

That would seem to be a bit contradictory, unless it is just the novelty value of the new car

**Polyal** · 14-05-2006, 10:33 AM

Ok read it last night, the falcons interior did get a canning which is fair enough too. but the commy has the best? I dont loody think so! I haven't seen a 300C's interior first hand, but a commy is nothing to write home about AT ALL.

And they think the Senator looks classy....ok.....

Seems to be a rushed article if you ask me.

**russellw** · 14-05-2006, 12:21 PM

I have seen the SRT8 interior first hand and the Senator and owned a GT-P and if they are going to hand that win to the Senator then they need their heads tested.

The GT-P has the nicest steering wheel of the three along with the best dash layout (even if it isn't all that informative and the current model gauge pods are ugly) and the seats are nicely bolstered although not as comfy as the SRT8 ones. The Senator probably only gets a win for gizmos but it's a close call.

I agree with most of the rest of the article. The GT-P is definitely the chassis pick of the bunch but it does need more grunt to fully exploit the available grip. The Senator is quick around a circuit (for what it is) but the tyres will pay the price as with all late model Commodores. The SRT8 isn't as slow as one might think on a flowing track but suffers in really tight bits for corner entry speed.

I'll reserve judgement of the braking packages until I've run another set of brake tests at Heathcote with the SRT8 against a standard braked GT-P.

Cheers
Russ

Cobra · 14-05-2006, 02:31 PM

How the hell can MOTOR say that the GT's interior lacks the quality of the senetor? Granted I havn't read the article yet, but I thought it was a very odd comment when I read that in the little caption.

As for them all wanting to drive the SRT-8, that doesn't surprise me at all. As everyone else has said, it's a novelty as it's something new. But I reckon that huge grunty Hemi would have something to do with it aswell.

Cobra · 14-05-2006, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDAA

Only maybe marginally. As it was the GT out-braked the lot of them so it was only really an interior thing. Besides the seats there's not much difference is there? They also made the comment along the lines of "You would swear the GT was 200kg lighter than the others around the corners" or something like that.

I think it's comparo's like this that makes me think that with the FPV package the way it is these days, if they only would supercharge the BOSS engine from factory nothing much would touch it (within the same category). Damn ADR,...let the GTHO go thru..(Opps did I say that?

: )

Did you hear they've uprated the power on the 06 Shelby GT-500? It was rated at 475hp (354kw) but now it's been rated to 500hp (373kw). GTHO worthy? With HSV looking at the LS7 (505hp/376kw) it would definately sit well. I think the blown 5.4 could easily squeeze out a few more horses with just a PCM re calibration if FPV felt the need to. I also think it would have more usable power the the LS7 down low, and probably have a better spread of torque through the revs. The LS7 would be to HSV what the V10 is to the M5, and the 5.4L BOSS would be to FPV what the AMG blown V8 is to the E55. As far as street drivability, I know what appeals to me more...

From all reports the Orion will have a factory blown motor though. Probably detuned from the base 336kw/450hp base power to sit in an FPV, but not by too much I wouldn't imagine. I've resigned to the fact that no N/A BOSS will be able to touch a turbo. The only thing FPV can make to come out of the factory running 12's with 8 cylinders would be a blown BOSS. I reckon it would put those Typhoons in their place, and maybe even be a better BFYB on performance and mods. If 4.6L blown donk in the 03/04 "Terminator" stangs is anything to go by, just imagine the potential of the 5.4L!

WASP · 14-05-2006, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobra

How the hell can MOTOR say that the GT's interior lacks the quality of the senetor? Granted I havn't read the article yet, but I thought it was a very odd comment when I read that in the little caption.

I think it was more lacking features rather than quality. if they used the GT-P it would of made that difference less I would imagine. Still, I love my GT leather interior and I've been in a Clubsport. I know which one I would have..by a long shot.

WASP · 14-05-2006, 03:58 PM

Try getting a supercharged big Hp monster past euro 3 emissions for starters..

But, where there's a will, there's a way..

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV

Thats a huge insight into why we havent seen one. I wonder what ADR it is in conflict with, bonnet clearance? If its in conflict with a ADR then i guess we won't see anything until the orion. Unless they are working on trying to pass it through, hopefully thats the case, cause im sure HSV will have something in the bag for this year.

On a different note, i find it hard to believe the HSV senator had better build quality. Is the senator really a huge difference between it and the lesser models. In a previous wheels magazine with the GT-P vs Senator, they said the Senator had a more upmarket ambience.

Cobra · 14-05-2006, 04:50 PM

Don't America have to comply with Euro 3 aswell? If so then it The blown 5.4 would be euro 3 compliant.

XR8 Uterous · 14-05-2006, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Mike

GTHO you say... I haven't researched this, but wasn't there an F-150 Lightening or something along those lines in USA with - and I'm only guessing here - a supercharged 5.4 3V Boss motor factory?

Yeah i have heard of that, apparently the worlds quickest ute/pickup.

Would be very nice to get some of the engine components from that into a 5.4 boss.

nb_351 · 14-05-2006, 04:58 PM

that srt was in at work on thursday... the exact one that everyone has been testing... a high end customer wanted to drive it... so we had to give it a clean and fill her with petrol... the sound of it was fantastic... very lumpy... and that is a big lump of a motor... the kit looks really nice...

Walkinshaw · 14-05-2006, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDAA

Try getting a supercharged big Hp monster past euro 3 emissions for starters..

But, where there's a will, there's a way..

E55 does it.....as does the Twin turbo SL65, Cayane turbo etc.....big $$ though

FPV · 14-05-2006, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDAA

Try getting a supercharged big Hp monster past euro 3 emissions for starters..

But, where there's a will, there's a way..

Ahh ok that explains it then, i guess Euro 3 emissions have been causing a bit of drama at FPV then. Like Cobra has said there is the GT500 engine waiting, however since there have been rumours that this car has been developed already and is just sitting there, id suspect that its an FPV developed blown boss, either way both would be great engines. Hopefully they will be able to get it to pass euro 3 emissions and we will see something interesting sooner rather then later, then GTHO buyers can go euro hunting and take on HSV as well.

FPV · 14-05-2006, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walkinshaw

E55 does it.....as does the Twin turbo SL65, Cayane turbo etc.....big $$ though

The E55 was actually replaced recently by the E63. Some have been saying that the change was influenced by new pedistrian laws dictating that there should be clearance between the bonnet and engine, but that was on a US site.

Noddy · 14-05-2006, 05:43 PM

The blown djr is making 450+rwhp with i think 6psi, apart from the euro3 emissions selling a car like this to the public with a warranty would be near impossible.

FPV · 14-05-2006, 05:50 PM

Well maybe Motor and Wheels journalists have a chat around the watercooler every so often, because both of them giving the gong to the senator for the interior sounds suss. Like CDAA has mentioned they could very well see it from a features point of view, from VYII, the senator had LED lighting in the interior or something, lighting up the console, don't know exactly how that works though. VZ Senator showed the introduction of nappa leather as well, so i guess it would be "suprise and delight features" in wheels terms.

On the 300c front, it will be undergoing an interior revamp in the future. Don't know exactly when though, the MY07(2006) models possibly.

Steffo · 14-05-2006, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV

The E55 was actually replaced recently by the E63. Some have been saying that the change was influenced by new pedistrian laws dictating that there should be clearance between the bonnet and engine, but that was on a US site.

The site was wrong. The new 6.2litre V8 is a unique to AMG engine. The previous 5.4 was a stroked version of the 225kW 460Nm 5.0 engine that featured in the SL500, S500, CL500, ML500, E500, CLK500 etc etc. The new 6.2 is assembled at AMG and is not shared with any non-AMG badged model. It is eventually going to be their only engine, with a twin turbo version slated to replace the TT V12 in the 65-Series LWB cars.

FPV · 14-05-2006, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steffo

The site was wrong. The new 6.2litre V8 is a unique to AMG engine. The previous 5.4 was a stroked version of the 225kW 460Nm 5.0 engine that featured in the SL500, S500, CL500, ML500, E500, CLK500 etc etc. The new 6.2 is assembled at AMG and is not shared with any non-AMG badged model. It is eventually going to be their only engine, with a twin turbo version slated to replace the TT V12 in the 65-Series LWB cars.

I meant the model E55 was replaced by the E63, i know it is a sole developed AMG engine, the 6.2l engine that is. I was just saying that some have said one of the reasons why the E55 has undergone an engine change to become E63, is due to the pedistrian laws. However when i think about it now, it doesnt make sense as the SL55 is continuing, albeit with a HP increase.

Full Spectrum · 15-05-2006, 02:14 AM

It's a very nice interior in the senator, Very comfy in the seats very smooth feeling.

ClevlndStemer · 15-05-2006, 12:34 PM

To be honest the GT in the article doesn't look classy at all with the stripes, huge wing, etc, looks like a Japanese fan boi's wet dream with all that plastic and sticker crap. The Senator and the 300C own it in terms of style and class. FPV need to rid of the "styling enhancements" and get with some decent power and quality (fit & finish).