Is the Golden Era of Oz Cricket Over? - Page 5

prydey · 03-02-2009, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

How about his awareness of the wicket and where his gloves were?

Watch the youtube clip above again, watch how he rises with the ball, his hands tucked behind the stumps and the moment he clears the stumps his hands push forward beyond the stumps. I can't believe a keeper of his experience wasn't aware that his gloves were beyond the stumps. There's two issues I see, one is that he broke the stumps and the second is that he was attempting to take the ball before the stumps. IMO, that is indefensible.

i'm not denying it was a no ball. it clearly was. no argument.

i just don't like to crucify an aussie cricketer when there is a slight chance it was a genuine error. it may be a schoolboy error but these things do happen.

just for the record, i'm not argueing with anyone here

. i love a good cricket discussion and i am a fairly loyal aussie supporter. i'll go into bat for the aussies just as hard as putts will stick up for the kiwis.

XR8putts · 04-02-2009, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

just for the record, i'm not argueing with anyone here

. i love a good cricket discussion and i am a fairly loyal aussie supporter. i'll go into bat for the aussies just as hard as putts will stick up for the kiwis.

And India ofcourse! All healthy debate

And speaking of which, Inida have just thrashed Sri Lanka (India got 363/5 in an ODI yesterday, Sri Lanka lost by ~140 runs) and have won the series 3-0 with games remaining. Interesting to note that India are only two or three points behind Australia in the ODI rankings, and that was on the 1st of Feb, since then India has won two games and Aussie have lost one - Australia could soon slip to 3rd in the ODI rankings very soon.

I won't mention that NZ is next inline and that if they continue their current form and Australia continue their current form, Australia could slip to 4th as NZ moves up into the top 3

.

gtxb67 · 05-02-2009, 08:39 AM

i know this subject was meant to be put to bed, but on triple m yesterday they were talking about it and a caller suggested haddin had done the same thing in the west indies. stuart magill who have been diplomatic but not supportive of haddin, agreed it happened and said he had forgotten all about it and then went very quiet
does anyone remember it or did anyone see it
IF it is the second time it has happened (in a year) it would seem to me to be very poor form

XR8putts · 07-02-2009, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Its ok,the Aussies will be treated like heroes once again after they beat that "TOUGH" New Zealand team in the one dayers.........

:

Did anyone else see Haddin signal to the NZ fans to hush when Australia got someone out? Also, Ponting claiming Vettori apologized via txt regarding the incident in game 1, but when the media asked Vetori, he said he said he txted him saying "lets move on". The media then asked Haddin who said "I can't remember" (the txt)..

Australia have now slipped to third in the Internation ODI rankings, with NZ only a few points behind in fourth.

Good times!

prydey · 07-02-2009, 09:51 PM

its obvious australian selectors don't put too much emphasis/weight in the chappell/hadlee series, by not playing ponting. i'm not saying he would've made any difference but if it was RSA or india he wouldn't have been rested.

we got beaten 3 nil by nz before the last world cup and then went through undefeated, but i don't see that happening again.

i don't think anyone other than ponting has scored a hundred this summer (for australia).

makes it hard for loyal supporters like me to keep finding positives, esp when all the poms at work are reminding me every day how we're doing and that the ashes are coming.

XR8putts · 08-02-2009, 08:06 AM

You'll be happy to know he's back for todays game!

If NZ win the next two games, they'll overtake Aussie in the ODI rankings, moving upto third.

BZINGA · 08-02-2009, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puts99

You'll be happy to know he's back for todays game!

If NZ win the next two games, they'll overtake Aussie in the ODI rankings, moving upto third.

Yep punter has been rushed back into the squad for today's game, panic has set into the camp lol.

If you think the Aussies are going bad, the WIndies have bowled the poms out for 51 runs to win the test by 23 runs. They posted over 300 runs in the 1st innings, the pitch must've had more cracks opened up than a sydney mardi gras

prydey · 08-02-2009, 08:52 AM

he was originally out for 2 games i heard. maybe the selectors didn't think much of clarke's captaincy although that is his first loss in 8 games as captain i think. i didn't see any of friday's game due to work so can't comment.
i don't quite understand the idea of resting players anyway. they play 2 games on the w/end with the rest of the week off, except for the cominng week. its not like footy or something where they are running around a lot.

once again i think we are seeing a big name retire (haydon) and no plan in place for when that happened. openers are very important to a cricket side, as is a settled middle order. chopping and changing it around isn't doing anyone any favours. why the selctors haven't given M.Klinger a look, i'll never know. has a better average and record than warner and way more experience (has actually played 1st class cricket) and yet can't get a gig. probably the fact that he plays for south australia.

sometimes i feel the selectors office must actually be at the scg and they just look out the window from time to time to see who is playing and pick from there.

australia are having a woeful summer. i believe we can remain good enough to compete with the best there is in the test arena with a fully fit bowling attack - lee, clark, johnson, watson etc. the one day arena is also lacking some fit players but the intensity is gone also.

hopefully we can see a decent run rate today.

prydey · 08-02-2009, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRIK67

If you think the Aussies are going bad, the WIndies have bowled the poms out for 51 runs to win the test by 23 runs. They posted over 300 runs in the 1st innings, the pitch must've had more cracks opened up than a sydney mardi gras

make that an innings and 23.

BZINGA · 08-02-2009, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

make that an innings and 23.

Yup my mistake.

BZINGA · 08-02-2009, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

he was originally out for 2 games i heard. maybe the selectors didn't think much of clarke's captaincy although that is his first loss in 8 games as captain i think.

Ponting rang selectors and demanded to play, was his decision too return not the selectors asking.

gtxb67 · 08-02-2009, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRIK67

Ponting rang selectors and demanded to play, was his decision too return not the selectors asking.

i believe the decision to rest was not his. he did not want the break but the selectors convinced/forced him. maybe he respects new zealand more than the selectors

BZINGA · 08-02-2009, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtxb67

i believe the decision to rest was not his. he did not want the break but the selectors convinced/forced him. maybe he respects new zealand more than the selectors

I'm not a fan of this resting players thing, it's not like they play every day of the week and need a rest, maybe this chopping and changing thing is a big part of the problem atm?

prydey · 08-02-2009, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

he was originally out for 2 games i heard. maybe the selectors didn't think much of clarke's captaincy although that is his first loss in 8 games as captain i think. i didn't see any of friday's game due to work so can't comment.
i don't quite understand the idea of resting players anyway. they play 2 games on the w/end with the rest of the week off, except for the coming week. its not like footy or something where they are running around a lot.

once again i think we are seeing a big name retire (haydon) and no plan in place for when that happened. openers are very important to a cricket side, as is a settled middle order. chopping and changing it around isn't doing anyone any favours. why the selctors haven't given M.Klinger a look, i'll never know. has a better average and record than warner and way more experience (has actually played 1st class cricket) and yet can't get a gig. probably the fact that he plays for south australia.

sometimes i feel the selectors office must actually be at the scg and they just look out the window from time to time to see who is playing and pick from there.

australia are having a woeful summer. i believe we can remain good enough to compete with the best there is in the test arena with a fully fit bowling attack - lee, clark, johnson, watson etc. the one day arena is also lacking some fit players but the intensity is gone also.

hopefully we can see a decent run rate today.

trik67 - you and i think alike!

Rodp · 08-02-2009, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

makes it hard for loyal supporters like me to keep finding positives, esp when all the poms at work are reminding me every day how we're doing and that the ashes are coming.

They should spend more time worrying about their own team. Australia might be on the downswing but so are England.

At least they should leave you alone Monday. ;)

Rodp · 08-02-2009, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRIK67

I'm not a fan of this resting players thing, it's not like they play every day of the week and need a rest, maybe this chopping and changing thing is a big part of the problem atm?

Squad rotation has always been a part of the ODI scene in Australia. I believe the theory is trying to get some stale players or blood new players infront of large crowds and quality opposition.

I don't know if this round has been some sort of disciplinary action or trying to give Clarke a go at the reins but I don't see the value in resting your best batsmen.

prydey · 08-02-2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

They should spend more time worrying about their own team. Australia might be on the downswing but so are England.

At least they should leave you alone Monday. ;)

don't you worry, i've already been sending sms's to some. england have a history of these sort of totals.

BZINGA · 08-02-2009, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

Squad rotation has always been a part of the ODI scene in Australia. I believe the theory is trying to get some stale players or blood new players infront of large crowds and quality opposition.

I don't know if this round has been some sort of disciplinary action or trying to give Clarke a go at the reins but I don't see the value in resting your best batsmen.

Yeah i know the rotation system has been around for awhile but i think the best thing they did was introduce the Aus A side, that's where you can blood new players and watch how they react. The Aussie team atm is not settled and i believe that's the problem.

prydey · 08-02-2009, 06:35 PM

rather than start a new thread i'll just keep this one ticking along.

regardless of who you barrack for, no one could honestly agree with steve bucknor's decisions today regarding running on the pitch. talk about harsh. luckily it didn't impact the total too much. maybe 5 or so runs.

obviously the pitch is good so we'll still have to bowl and field at our best. too many times we've posted 300+ scores against the kiwi's only to see them chase it down. no cairns, astle, oram, mcmillan, fleming etc this time though.

also not to drag the discussions down again but surely vettori would've heard a double noise when callum ferguson smacked it into his back pad. it was clear on tv but i realise thats through the stump microphone and not necessarily what the players/ump hears. if you are going to call someone a cheat, don't be appealing when there was clearly a big chunk of bat. before anyone arc's up...yes i know this can in no way be compared to haddin's incident last game.

sometimes there is a clear case for the introduction of this referral system.

XR8putts · 08-02-2009, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

also not to drag the discussions down again but surely vettori would've heard a double noise when callum ferguson smacked it into his back pad. it was clear on tv but i realise thats through the stump microphone and not necessarily what the players/ump hears. if you are going to call someone a cheat, don't be appealing when there was clearly a big chunk of bat. before anyone arc's up...yes i know this can in no way be compared to haddin's incident last game.

Well Hillfenhaus just got Ross Taylor out LBW, with an inside edge. Do you have the same to say of him? Ofcourse not.

You're right, it can in no way be compared to Haddin's incident, so why say Vetori is a bit rich when acused Haddin of cheating. You're saying something, but then saying you shouldn't. But you just did. Haddin blatantly cheated, and denied it, whereas Vetori appealed for a an LBW with a slight inside edge that everybody missed, just like Hillfenhaus just now.

I'm an optimist, but this games a goner - bring on Tuesday :( Full credit to Australia, finally put a decent total on the board (should've got 320 though!) - and Buknor's running on the wicket calls should have him sacked.

Rodp · 08-02-2009, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

also not to drag the discussions down again but surely vettori would've heard a double noise when callum ferguson smacked it into his back pad. it was clear on tv but i realise thats through the stump microphone and not necessarily what the players/ump hears. if you are going to call someone a cheat, don't be appealing when there was clearly a big chunk of bat. before anyone arc's up...yes i know this can in no way be compared to haddin's incident last game.

I haven't watched any of the game but I presume he was given out by the umpire? (seeing as the scorecard lists lbw b.Vettori) If that is the case then it would appear that the big chunk of bat wasn't obvious to those at the bowler's end.

An incident like that is worthy of an appeal, may have hit pad before bat or bat before pad. Perhaps Vettori didn't know which came first and asked the question - umpire agreed. If the expert adjudicating behind the stumps thinks it's out then you can't start assuming that the bowler is a cheat for appealing.

Never quite understood the 'if you appeal when it's obviously not out then you're cheating...' line. I've appealed on occassions when it was obvious to some from a certain vantage point that it wasn't out but to my vantage point I thought it was a chance, particularly some leg side catches I've taken. Other times I've not appealed because it obviously wasn't out... and it was out.

XR8putts · 08-02-2009, 07:11 PM

Tiny bottom edge while attempted a sweep shot.. everyone missed it - not untill a few replays was it even picked up.

prydey · 08-02-2009, 07:32 PM

in my defense, i thought ferguson hit it when i watched it live. also i wasn't exactly calling vettori a cheat, i was merely pointing out that everyone appeals if they think they can be given out.

putts- the kiwi innings is still not on tv here so can't comment on the taylor dismissal. the cricinfo commentary said it was a good decision but not sure if they had seen replays though.

at least we agree on bucknor though!

Rodp · 08-02-2009, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

in my defense, i thought ferguson hit it when i watched it live. also i wasn't exactly calling vettori a cheat, i was merely pointing out that everyone appeals if they think they can be given out.

You could opine then that umpires are superflous in giving decisions if players only ever appealed when they know that it's definitely out. That's what you seem to be suggesting over the Vettori appeal.

Vettori must have known that there was a bottom edge so he had no right appealing given his stance on Haddin even though the umpire believed that all criteria had been met to give the batsmen out LBW. So, if the appeal is upheld, how can you possibly be dirty on the bowler for appealing?

blueoval · 08-02-2009, 10:03 PM

Australia wins this match, but not convincingly IMHO.

I think NZ will win in Adelaide

XR8putts · 08-02-2009, 10:22 PM

I'm impressed NZ made a good fight of it, a few things going in favour of NZ and they were in. Untill Elliot got out, I think NZ were gonna make it.

Great job by Eliiot, seems to be our Duminy lately. Can anyone tell me who got man of the match as our coverage for some reason was cut short?

Congrats to Aus, more convincing than their prior outings. Adelaide should be a cracker, heres hopeing it's a sellout to aid the fundraising for the fire victims.

BZINGA · 09-02-2009, 12:15 AM

LBW - Why not refer LBW too the 3rd umpire, it's only a matter of time before it happens so why not now? If the umpire thinks it's out or has some doubt, refer it too the 3rd umpire. Better too have the decision right then wrong yeah? It's happening too often now that it's a wrong call so i say bring in the 3rd ump.

vztrt · 09-02-2009, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puts99

Great job by Eliiot, seems to be our Duminy lately. Can anyone tell me who got man of the match as our coverage for some reason was cut short?

Haddin got it, which surprised me as I thought Elliot should have got it as he got NZ back into the game...or would that have been Bracken and that rubbish display of bowling in his third spell?

Rodp · 09-02-2009, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRIK67

LBW - Why not refer LBW too the 3rd umpire, it's only a matter of time before it happens so why not now? If the umpire thinks it's out or has some doubt, refer it too the 3rd umpire. Better too have the decision right then wrong yeah? It's happening too often now that it's a wrong call so i say bring in the 3rd ump.

While I'm all for some decisions being referred to a 3rd umpire (particularly run-outs and stumpings), but LBW isn't one of them.

Snicko has been shown to be somewhat unreliable at times, Hawkeye I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw it but the main problem being that the technology takes far too long in those instances to reach a decision.

The current umpiring process is simple. If the umpire has some doubt then it's automatically not out. It's never a case of being.. 'well, that's close enough so I may as well give it'.

Cricket is a slow enough game as it is, and while it should be a goal to get decisions correct all the time, it's just not feasable.

Rodp · 09-02-2009, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Haddin got it, which surprised me as I thought Elliot should have got it as he got NZ back into the game...or would that have been Bracken and that rubbish display of bowling in his third spell?

But they didn't win the game.

Can only recall the odd occassion where one of the losing team's players got MOM... only because his individual effort far surpassed that of any player on the winning side. Haddin's innings won Australia the game has to trump Elliot's innings that gave NZ a chance at winning the game.