Ford executives comment on the future of Falcon and Territory

[Brazen]

As long as the next model 'Falcon' can be exported then 20,000 sales a year could be fine.

I think sometimes we underestimate the size and importance of the Australian market, we can make stuff here as we are some of the biggest buyers of the following models in the world (excluding US and China):

Mazda 3
Corolla
Cruze
Camry
Pajero
Patrol
Forrester
LandCruiser
BT-50
Navara
Ranger

If Ford can find a global model which Australia has the potential to be the biggest market, then there could be very sound reason to making it here. If the next Falcon is a global model shared with Taurus, then I wouldnt be suprised that we would be one of the biggest buyers of that car.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I think sometimes we underestimate the size and importance of the Australian market, we can make stuff here

Ford Australia is one of only 3 places in the Ford empire that can bring a car from a blank sheet of paper (more like computer screen these days) to the showroom floor. I cannot for the life of me see why the brass would dilute or extinguish that capability.

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Ford Australia is one of only 3 places in the Ford empire that can bring a car from a blank sheet of paper (more like computer screen these days) to the showroom floor. I cannot for the life of me see why the brass would dilute or extinguish that capability.

Because the volume does not justify the expense?

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Because the volume does not justify the expense?

Then give the manufacturing facilities some more volume with products that people will buy. Doesn't need to be for the domestic market exclusively, it could also be for our region. That 120,000p/a plant capacity is going to waste at the moment, in a manner of speaking.

[Elks]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Have you purchased a new Ford.

Yes a few. And the have all been exceelnt cars. Not perfect, but very happy with them.

I had the joy of driving an Aurion for 5 months (work provided) . How anyone could buy one over a Falcon has me beat. It has auto up windows but it has lots of sorque steer, it has a shade blind and the turning circle of truck, it has auto on wipers and the raod manners of a cow.

I do agree that FoA has made a couple of fundemental errors in the FG. I own one and it is a great car.

1. The styling in the lower range XT / XR cars looks and more importantly photographs like a BF. I personally don't like this strategy, although it works for many of the europeans brands.

2. The rebranding of Fairmont to G6. Fairmont has a place in the car buyers mind G6 doesnt. How many G6 owners descriobe there cars to people as the new Faimont. Then worse still not promoting what it it is.

3. The combination of these two things which are at odds with each other - so it it all new or evolution?

my2c

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

Which one would you go for and why?

My choice is G6ET or Terry Titanium. One family member has an AWD Titanium and I had it overnight and liked it a lot. The diesel is smoother then the I6 and the high driving position provided better view ahead. The practicality is unquestioned. I then get back in my G6ET (which i drive only on weekends) and a smile just instantly appears on my face. The performance is intoxicating. And I think it looks great with the bling.

I would choose the Terry over the Mondeo because of the better driving dynamics (people may laugh but a Terry out drives my old BA wagon), the epas system works very well, it has just and I mean a barely just enough tech to keep me happy and affords the feeling of better security by riding higher.

You can't actually make a bad decision I feel.

[R-Design]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

Which one would you go for and why?

It's a funny dilemma isn't it. I really like the mondeo, it still looks fresh externally, and has heaps of tech, but the interior is starting to show its age. When the new model is revealed at the Detroit motorshow it'll drop off your shopping list, why would you buy something so late into the model cycle? Territory is the same for me, the new model is great and the diesel a cracker, but that skin although updated has been around since 2005(?), thats ancient. I guess thats why Im leaning towards the Falcon I just wish that when they decided they weren't going to make a wagon they built a hatch instead if a sedan, call me crazy but I think it would have given the extra flexibility the car lacks.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

A decision would have been made by now on a post 2015/16 Falcon, if it hasn't, then it would be extremely close.

If you compare the sales figures of other Ford models from around the globe and see the investment being thrown at them, then there's no reason to suggest that the same isn't happening with Falcon.

Ford have continued to express their position about a large RWD platform, which is they want one and will have one. This can only mean one thing for Falcon, and to me it suggests it will be a part of that plan.

The Mondeo/Falcon is interesting and could potentially work, if the hard points of the next Falcon see it downsizing, then it only makes sense that they consolidate with next gen CD, but I personally think that's unlikely. I'm facing this delema right now, I'm replacing the wifes car (which is the family car), now although the 2 cars we have as options are not competing in class, they both tick enough boxes to be competing for the dollar, and the cars are the Mondeo Titanium Wagon or a Titanium Territory Diesel. Unfortunately the Falcon is not even a consideration, and that's not a good thing.

At the moment the decision as to which one to go for is extremely hard, the Mondeo will likely meet all our needs and has an abundance of Tech, while the Territory has practicality, versatility and has a sufficient amount of tech, but still lacking. These are the things that at the moment, are failing local Ford products and i'm sure everybody here knows that. Which one would you go for and why?

Future Falcon will be a different kettle of fish, and potentially still not a complete 'One' Ford strategy, but increasing the amount of one ford componentry and tech that will make it more competitive.

Thanks JPFS1, it sounds like your situation is typical of a lot of potential Falcon buyers....

This should be required reading for Ford market researchers,

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by FPV GTHO

Its their best chance with what theyre about to put to market in the immediate future. They cant callenge Lexus with theoretical GWRD platforms spawning hybrid AWD Mustangs and Super Continentals.

That makes little sense.... but okay.

Ford can't compete with leathered, wool carpeted, cashmere and chrome lined Fusions either.

They need special vehicles. With unique drivetrains. Infact... these are points they're working on.

[BroadyFord]

Another worrying article...

Ford hedges bets on Victoria

http://theage.drive.com.au/motor-new....html#comments

ONE of Ford's most senior global executives has admitted the company's manufacturing base in Australia is not guaranteed beyond the lifespan of the current Falcon and Territory.

Ford's president for Asia Pacific and Africa, Joe Hinrichs, also revealed no decision had been made on what vehicle would replace these locally developed models when they are retired around the middle of the decade and admitted the company was ''grappling'' with both issues.

The news comes as weekend reports suggest that Ford's US parent company will inject $50 million towards the locally produced cars to secure medium-term production.
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''The challenge is on the business side,'' Mr Hinrichs said. "Whenever that timeline ends on the current platform, what next? And is there a business case for it to be manufactured in Australia?

''That's the industry challenge, the government challenge and the Ford challenge, all wrapped in one.

''We are grappling with that now because we look out five years in our business planning process and so here we are starting 2012 and we have a scenario where we are starting to do planning on expectations for emission requirements, fuel economy expectations, weight and so on.''

Ford builds the Falcon sedan and ute and Territory SUV at Broadmeadows in Melbourne and 4.0-litre in-line six-cylinder petrol engines in Geelong.

The viability of both plants has been under question because of declining large car sales. Last year Falcon sales plunged 36.5 per cent to just 18,741. The silver lining was the resurgence of the recently revised Territory to the top of the SUV sales ladder.

Holden Commodore sales also fell last year, 11.6 per cent, and the car was knocked from the top of the sales charts for the first time in 15 years.

The new number one is the Mazda3, the first imported car to take the spot in almost 100 years.

New car buyers have progressively shifted to small cars and SUVs, most of which are imported. The high dollar has also proved a double negative for local manufacturers, who have seen export markets dry up and imports increase their competition.

The fall in sales of locally manufactured cars has prompted the Minister for Manufacturing, Senator Kim Carr, and South Australian Premier Jay Weatherill to head to Detroit for meetings with both Ford and Holden parent General Motors.

The federal government's decision to cut the Green Car Innovation Fund in 2011 has dismayed local manufacturers, as has the recent demotion of the widely respected Senator Carr.

Holden chairman Mike Devereux has gone on the record warning the government that reduced support will endanger continued investment by General Motors. But Mr Hinrichs said Ford would not follow a similar course of public lobbying or complaint.

''We wouldn't have that conversation in the public domain if we were to have it,'' he said. ''Our expectation is that if we have something we'll need government support on, we'll find a way to make it work like we do everywhere else in the world.''

The problem is that at today's levels the Broadmeadows plant lacks the economy of scale to be cost-competitive against huge plants such as those in Thailand and India.

When the Falcon and Territory are replaced by global models under the One Ford strategy, the need to build locally may evaporate.

''The most important thing we all can do is maintain a cost-competitiveness,'' Mr Hinrichs said. ''So volume and scale come into play in that regard and that is a challenge for the Australian market.

''Broadmeadows volume has dropped and that is a concern, but that doesn't mean we are predetermined to one outcome … These are complex issues.''

Mr Hinrichs insisted no decision had been made yet on what would replace the Falcon and Territory, rejecting reports they would be replaced by the front/all-wheel-drive Taurus and Explorer SUV built in the US.

''We have not made a decision,'' he said. ''We plan for alternatives because we are in business but we are still investing in the Falcon and the Territory.''

[BroadyFord]

^^ Aside from the pointless and misleading article title, the fact that they SAY they've made haven't made a decision leads me to believe that they have and are just delaying the inevitable.

[csv8]

Ford Falcon gets a lifeline
By Paul GoverCarsguide08 January 2012

The future of Ford Australia will be confirmed in the US on Tuesday.



And it will bring good news for the company's 3500 production staff in Victoria. A fresh injection of more than $50 million is coming from Ford Motor Company that will secure the immediate future of the Falcon and Territory despite the worst showroom result in the history of the Ford flagship in 2011.

An announcement is planned for the Detroit motor show involving Ford's global chiefs, local president Bob Graziano, and a government delegation led by the Federal Minister for Industry Kim Carr. The true scale of the investment is still a secret, but it comes as both Ford Australia and GM Holden jockey for positions in the future model plans of their global parents.

Neither can afford to be left out of accelerating globalisation that is reducing the number of individual models produced around the world. Senator Carr is visiting Detroit with the Premier of South Australia, Jay Wetherill, to try and ensure the Australian makers are included and is locked into make-or-break talks with both Ford and GM.

"I want Australia to remain a player at the table. It's critical for the future of the Australian automotive industry. It's pivotal," Carr told News Limited on Friday before leaving for Detroit. "It's not just for Ford and General Motors, but the whole industry. There are nearly 200 companies involved in the industry.

"This mission is all about fighting for jobs in Australia. There is no question that the rise of the Australian dollar has placed jobs under threat." Australia's three makers all suffered showroom setbacks during 2011, although Toyota has committed $350 million to a new engine factory in Melbourne, as well as the costly switch to an all-new Camry for 2012, and are being forced to justify their local positions. Ford and Holden each employ more than 1000 engineers and designers who are primarily involved in offshore development work, although their places are cemented by the local manufacturing operations.

A Holden-designed midsized car soon goes in production by GM and Ford engineers are responsible for an all-new compact SUV called the EcoSport, which will be built in India and sold in Australia in 2013. The Figo baby car, also developed in Australia, was India's Car of the Year in 2011 and the Ranger pickup - which will be followed this year by an SUV called Endeavour - also comes from Broadmeadows and is the first ute anywhere in the world to win a five-star NCAP safety rating. But there are still doubts, and the latest Ford cash from Detroit only protects Ford Australia's factories at Broadmeadows and Geelong until around 2018, when an all-new car is intended to take on the Falcon nameplate.

There are also questions over the Commodore from 2018, when the current program expires, and that has prompted Senator Carr's latest visit to motown. He will meet with GM's CEO and Dan Akerson and the CEO of Ford, Alan Mulally.

"We're going to secure new investment. There is a genuine concern about the future of the industry given the rapid acceleration in the Australian dollar. The high currency has placed enormous pressure on Australian manufacturing."

The latest talks come following a similar visit to China last year to talk with regional motoring bosses. "I'm a regular visitor to Detroit. And I was also in Shanghai in August to meet with their regional leadership for the Asia-Pacific. We have been dealing with this issues for some months. It's not something you do in just five minutes."

Senator Carr will not be specific about his needs, or what he has to offer the carmakers, but said he is committed. "Our whole approach has been predicated on co-investment and we're seeking long-term commitments to Australian manufacturing. And that can only be secured by new investments.

"We have the flexibility, and the wit and wisdom, for Australian governments - there are responsibilities for state governments as well - to build the partnerships that will last us for years to come. It's about understanding their attitude towards global investments. "You have to talk to the global leaders about the role of Australia. If governments don't take a key interest in this you can guarantee that we will not remain a player at the table."

[Polyal]

I also cant help feeling that its almost hush money until something is worked out, still good as thats a small win for FoA and FordNA gets a little more time up their sleeve to work it out properly. $50M for head office at the moment is chicken feed I would have thought.

[EgoFG]

Just edit it back to the quotes and it is nowhere near as bad

Originally Posted by Edited

Hinrichs: ''The challenge is on the business side, Whenever that timeline ends on the current platform, what next? And is there a business case for it to be manufactured in Australia?

''That's the industry challenge, the government challenge and the Ford challenge, all wrapped in one.

''We are grappling with that now because we look out five years in our business planning process and so here we are starting 2012 and we have a scenario where we are starting to do planning on expectations for emission requirements, fuel economy expectations, weight and so on.''

Holden chairman Mike Devereux :''We wouldn't have that conversation in the public domain if we were to have it, Our expectation is that if we have something we'll need government support on, we'll find a way to make it work like we do everywhere else in the world.''


Hinrichs: ''The most important thing we all can do is maintain a cost-competitiveness, So volume and scale come into play in that regard and that is a challenge for the Australian market.

''Broadmeadows volume has dropped and that is a concern, but that doesn't mean we are predetermined to one outcome … These are complex issues.''


''We have not made a decision, We plan for alternatives because we are in business but we are still investing in the Falcon and the Territory.''

[Road_Warrior]

Yep, weed out the opinionated crap from reporters with a bias toward a certain outcome and it looks less dramatic and disastrous.

[Brazen]

I think Falcon will definately go FWD/AWD. I just want it to be made in Australia.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I think Falcon will definately go FWD/AWD. I just want it to be made in Australia.

Ill wager it doesnt...why would you want AWD? Our super harsh conditions

[Redrum]

I would say around the time of the Detroit motor show the news will be either falcon to be built off the mustang platform, powertrain coming from the states, maybe some panel work and assembly here or an imported Taurus. Broadie may only be assembling the Territorys in years to come. Currently power train are only making 140 I6 a day. My days at Ford we used to assemble over 420 I6 models a day at Broadie. How things have changed. The high fuel price biggest killer.

[Gobes32]

Amazing, Gover's article was so upbeat and yet the Age newspaper has Ford Australia on it's knees.

To summarize, Heinrichs is saying we don't know whether to build cars in Oz or not, and Senator Carr is over there to bribe them to continue doing so. Or is that a too simplistic view of things?

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I think Falcon will definately go FWD/AWD. I just want it to be made in Australia.

Me too mate, any car is good. Just so long as it is proudly built in Australia and keeping food on the table for numerous aussie families.

[FPV GTHO]

If theyre not going to repackage the next Taurus as a Falcon (which has alrready been dismissed apparently) then theres no point IMO going FWD. The only option is to repackage Mondeo/Fusion then, which to me seems pointless given the traction Mondeo is making in the marketplace. Why not just locally produce Mondeo and drop Falcon in that case.

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by Drive

Holden chairman Mike Devereux has gone on the record warning the government that reduced support will endanger continued investment by General Motors. But Mr Hinrichs said Ford would not follow a similar course of public lobbying or complaint.

''We wouldn't have that conversation in the public domain if we were to have it,'' he said. ''Our expectation is that if we have something we'll need government support on, we'll find a way to make it work like we do everywhere else in the world.''

That's a dig at GM right there.

[Falc'man]

An announcement is planned for the Detroit motor show involving Ford's global chiefs, (by) local president Bob Graziano, and a government delegation led by the Federal Minister for Industry Kim Carr. The true scale of the investment is still a secret, but it comes as both Ford Australia and GM Holden jockey for positions in the future model plans of their global parents.

On one hand Carr is supposedly there in "make-or-break" talks with Ford.
On the other hand, as noted above, he will be part of some announcement.

I wonder if his announcement will include bad news at all. Like a politician always would want to be the barer of bad news. I doubt it. And I doubt that he would have traveled there had he not had confirmation that the decision was positive. It's why Gover is so upbeat.
I could be wrong.

[Road_Warrior]

Yeah I don't think a pollie would be in tow, rubbing shoulders with motor industry elite if there was bad news in the offing, it would look real bad from a political perspective. In fact, political suicide for any incumbent MP in Victoria.

I think the only announcement we're going to get is the one about $50 Mill and that's it. Nothing about future product plans.

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Yeah I don't think a pollie would be in tow, rubbing shoulders with motor industry elite if there was bad news in the offing, it would look real bad from a political perspective. In fact, political suicide for any incumbent MP in Victoria.

I think the only announcement we're going to get is the one about $50 Mill and that's it. Nothing about future product plans.

??? Nothing about future product plans? Ford said they would though.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Falc'man

??? Nothing about future product plans? Ford said they would though.

I was under the impression it was the media who said that and not Ford, the emphasis seems to have been on the 50 million and speculation about everything else.

[JPFS1]

the plan gets them through to 2018..

[dimka100]

They will be unveiling this one ...

http://www.caradvice.com.au/153892/2...detroit-debut/

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

the plan gets them through to 2018..

Wow, 2018 now? E8 will well and truly be long in the tooth by then.

[FPV GTHO]

They must have a MCA in development surely