February 2018 VFACTS: Honda booms as Holden slumps

[suttoo]

Originally Posted by Brodes

The Holden dealer around the corner switched to being a Haval dealer, probably a better bet.

If you talking plaza Holden, they didn't switch Holden terminated their franchise along with a fair few others around SA, two in my local area that had been with the brand for many years. Not winning too many friends with decisions like that, in country towns customers are very loyal to their dealers

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by Brodes

The Holden dealer around the corner switched to being a Haval dealer, probably a better bet.

Better than selling Daewoo's I guess

[danzvtil]

Originally Posted by suttoo

If you talking plaza Holden, they didn't switch Holden terminated their franchise along with a fair few others around SA, two in my local area that had been with the brand for many years. Not winning too many friends with decisions like that, in country towns customers are very loyal to their dealers

That group lost 2 Holden franchises, their Metro Holden deal ran out at the end of last year.

[lovford]

Holden are screwed. There replacement comy is made out of a 12 year old parts bin. Could someone please tell me how large the supercharger is on the Miami. (litre capacity)

[lovford]

Originally Posted by Brazen

As good as the new Commodore may be, my god it has one of the most boring colour palettes ever. Definately now a German car.

Its not good, its ****. They say the 4 wheel drive sports is made for the v8 buyer, what a load of ****. It is no faster than an AU falcon. It might have lots of tech, so fkn what.

[lovford]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

As a Commodore fan and buyer, I too would not buy the ZB because it’s not a commodore. Just in the same way that a Mondeo isn’t a Falcon.

Both ZB and Mondeo may be great cars, but neither are what I look for in a car.

Theres no respect for previous owners. They should of found a way to cram a turbo into the ZB. But no, they give us a car slower than an au. Fkn ****ers.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by lovford

Theres no respect for previous owners. They should of found a way to cram a turbo into the ZB. But no, they give us a car slower than an au. Fkn ****ers.

And so we vote with our wallets and don’t buy them.

I like this quote from Holden marketing chief Mark Harland:

Mr Harland said the fact the car was not Australian-made was receding in importance after their high-profile Adelaide factory shut down last October. “No one is manufacturing vehicles here. The chatter around an Australian-built car versus an import has died down. You really have no choice.”

Yes no choice to buy a new Australian car, but we certainly have a choice not to buy your Fakeadore

[whales]

If Ford don't keep on top of the Ranger with upgrades, extended warranties, good pricing etc. etc. they will be out of the top ten too.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by lovford

Its not good, its ****. They say the 4 wheel drive sports is made for the v8 buyer, what a load of ****. It is no faster than an AU falcon. It might have lots of tech, so fkn what.

Hilarious. Even the four cylinder has got way more power than any AU six, including the VCT. The XR8 220 wasn't all that quick either, certainly not by today's standards.

[lovford]

Originally Posted by NX74205

Hilarious. Even the four cylinder has got way more power than any AU six, including the VCT. The XR8 220 wasn't all that quick either, certainly not by today's standards.

94 EL XR6 0-100 7 seconds__99 AU XR6 0-100 7 seconds (non VCT's) I will eat my words and congratulate HOLDEN on the car there trumpeting as the SS replacement, the almighty ZB VXR is, .5 seconds faster than a 1993 FALCON XR6. Unbelievable improvement they have made in the last 25 years.

[prydey]

Have a look at the cars dominating the sales and that will give you a clue as to how important 0-100 times are.

[Dr Terry]

I can understand the sadness concerning the loss of our local car industry, but I cannot understand the bitterness towards the ZB Commodore.

Why can't we just wait & see what this car is like, time will tell all & the market will ultimately decide its future. Straight line performance & 0-100 times aren't everything, I have heard that a new ZB VXR did a quicker lap time around Philip Island quicker than a VF SS 6.2L.

I haven't driven one yet & I have no connection with Holden or any dealer, but I they don't look to bad. Most reviews have been positive, especially the one from Victoria Police a few weeks ago. I would place more validity on that review, than any of the online car magazines.

I've been in the automotive industry since 1970 & trust me there are some cars on the market which have very good images in the retail arena, but are not good cars at all.

Dr Terry

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by lovford

94 EL XR6 0-100 7 seconds__99 AU XR6 0-100 7 seconds

Don't know where you get your figures from, but you need to add about half a second to both those times, and another half a second if it's an auto. The four speed auto isn't a great gearbox.

And incidentally, 1994 was the EF, not the EL.

[MrZ]

Originally Posted by Brazen

As good as the new Commodore may be, my god it has one of the most boring colour palettes ever. Definately now a German car.

What are you talking about? There are 8 colour choices - more than most cars. Not all colours are available on all grades, so if you use the "build" tool on Holden's website, it might not show all available colours.

For example, there are 2 different whites - one solid and one pearl, but some models aren't available with the pearl. Aside from the whites, grey, silver, and black, there are 2 different shades of red, and a dark blue. That's really not bad at all.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

I can understand the sadness concerning the loss of our local car industry, but I cannot understand the bitterness towards the ZB Commodore.

Cant even put it down to school holidays

[lovford]

Originally Posted by prydey

Have a look at the cars dominating the sales and that will give you a clue as to how important 0-100 times are.

Big egos driving big trucks, and not using them for there intended purpose. Yea, that makes a lot of sense. Some of us like fire breathing dragons, and some like soot breathing dragons.

[lovford]

Originally Posted by NX74205

Don't know where you get your figures from, but you need to add about half a second to both those times, and another half a second if it's an auto. The four speed auto isn't a great gearbox.

And incidentally, 1994 was the EF, not the EL.

Same place that says vf Calais 6.2 litre 4.8 seconds__ve Calais 6.0 litre 5.3 seconds___ vy ss 5.8 seconds__Ba gt 5.9 seconds. (these are all auto) The ef and au were manual non vct. What do the above times sound like ?? Am I getting my information from the wrong site ??

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by lovford

Big egos driving big trucks, and not using them for there intended purpose. Yea, that makes a lot of sense. Some of us like fire breathing dragons, and some like soot breathing dragons.

More like fbt exemption.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by prydey

Have a look at the cars dominating the sales and that will give you a clue as to how important 0-100 times are.

You’d think as members of a car enthusiasts forum that at least we should care.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by vztrt

More like fbt exemption.

Only crew cab Utes are not FBT exempt, people only think they are because of 4x4 and 1 tonne rating.

[lra]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

I can understand the sadness concerning the loss of our local car industry, but I cannot understand the bitterness towards the ZB Commodore. Dr Terry

Hey Ford fans …….. how is the Falcon ‘replacement’, the Mondeo selling ? The ‘replacement’ Commodore should sell equally as well.
Would you accept a Mondeo/Fusion with a Falcon badge slapped on it ?

The ‘bitterness’ is the result of a lot of factors, closing the factory, being told how Holden will outsell Toyota by 2020 with 20(?) new models, that there is a new V8 sports car arriving soon, how the hipsters don’t want to drive a car that looks like my dad’s car, targeting the ‘let’s be gay’ society while alienating the bogan community who bought Commodores in the past, and the big one ……… putting the same name on a FWD 4cyl and a complicated AWD 6cyl import.

Yes, I know that the VB had a German name, and that it was an Opel design, but a comparison of the Holden and Opel versions was like comparing bratwurst to XXXX beer. The ZB may be a good car, but it has to overcome bad feelings towards Holden, and be screwed together better, and cheaper, than its established rivals, Toyota, Hyundai, Audi, Volkswagen, Skoda, Volvo, etc, etc.

[Dr Terry]

Originally Posted by lra

Hey Ford fans …….. how is the Falcon ‘replacement’, the Mondeo selling ? The ‘replacement’ Commodore should sell equally as well.
Would you accept a Mondeo/Fusion with a Falcon badge slapped on it ?

But is the Mondeo being marketed by Ford Aust. as a Falcon replacement ?

I don't think that Ford really market the Mondeo at all.

If Ford didn't have the Ranger, how would they be going right now ?
'
Dr Terry

[Adamz Ghia]

Originally Posted by lra

Hey Ford fans …….. how is the Falcon ‘replacement’, the Mondeo selling ? The ‘replacement’ Commodore should sell equally as well.
Would you accept a Mondeo/Fusion with a Falcon badge slapped on it ?

The ‘bitterness’ is the result of a lot of factors, closing the factory, being told how Holden will outsell Toyota by 2020 with 20(?) new models, that there is a new V8 sports car arriving soon, how the hipsters don’t want to drive a car that looks like my dad’s car, targeting the ‘let’s be gay’ society while alienating the bogan community who bought Commodores in the past, and the big one ……… putting the same name on a FWD 4cyl and a complicated AWD 6cyl import.

Yes, I know that the VB had a German name, and that it was an Opel design, but a comparison of the Holden and Opel versions was like comparing bratwurst to XXXX beer. The ZB may be a good car, but it has to overcome bad feelings towards Holden, and be screwed together better, and cheaper, than its established rivals, Toyota, Hyundai, Audi, Volkswagen, Skoda, Volvo, etc, etc.

For the who knows how many’th time, the Mondeo isn’t a Falcon replacement, it was never positioned as a Falcon replacement, Ford themselves have said it never was and never will be a Falcon replacement.

The ZB isn’t a Commodore replacement, it’s a totally different style of car. But to say it’s a piece of crap when 95% of the population haven’t even driven it yet is silly. Don’t judge the sales of either Commodore or Equinox yet, some dealers only just started receiving their stock in the last couple of weeks, a friend of mine just received her Equinox last Friday.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

.

If Ford didn't have the Ranger, how would they be going right now ?
'
Dr Terry

But they do have ranger.

Before that they were the falcon car company.

I would suggest Ford are well aware of how volatile the market is. They will be hoping the Everest continues to build (remember ranger wasn't an overnight success) also as that is another lucrative segment.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by lra

Would you accept a Mondeo/Fusion with a Falcon badge slapped on it ?

No.

They're very different cars, and I think I would be rather annoyed if Ford were to put the Falcon badge on a Mondeo - because the Mondeo is not a Falcon. So I think I know where Holden fans are coming from here.

But that's not to say that the new 'Commodore' will be a bad car. For the vast majority of buyers who don't buy these cars for its V8 engine or performance offerings, the new 'Commodore' would suit their needs just fine. In my case, I like Falcons not because of its hectic turbo six or thunderous supercharged V8, but rather, I like its long legged cruising ability on the highway. I don't care much for how fast it gets from 0-100km/h, I want a comfortable long distance highway cruiser. In that regard, the Mondeo beats the Falcon, easily, in every way that matters, perhaps with the exception of aural pleasure.

The new Commodore will no doubt be a brilliant car and a vast improvement over the VFII in many ways, just as the Mondeo is a better car than the Falcon in many ways. Whether it should be called the Commodore or Insignia is another debate.

[mr smith]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

But is the Mondeo being marketed by Ford Aust. as a Falcon replacement ?

I don't think that Ford really market the Mondeo at all.

If Ford didn't have the Ranger, how would they be going right now ?
'
Dr Terry

I think they have given up on the Mondeo and I can see why.
I had one for a year after the Falcon stopped. Couldn’t wait to get out of it..rubbish car.

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by mr smith

I think they have given up on the Mondeo and I can see why.
I had one for a year after the Falcon stopped. Couldn’t wait to get out of it..rubbish car.

Rubbish bias statement.

The new Mondeo is a really good car with lots of tech.

Most buyers would say it is a lot better than Falcon ever was (but this thread is about Feb VFacts).

[lovford]

Originally Posted by lra

Hey Ford fans …….. how is the Falcon ‘replacement’, the Mondeo selling ? The ‘replacement’ Commodore should sell equally as well.
Would you accept a Mondeo/Fusion with a Falcon badge slapped on it ?

Ford Aussie arn't championing the Mondeo as a XR8 replacement, unlike Holden that are saying the ZB VXR is a replacement for the SS buyers. Holden finally made the best car ever to roll of the Adelaide assembly line, and then canned it. Even the yanks love the VF SS we exported.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by lovford

Holden finally made the best car ever to roll of the Adelaide assembly line, and then canned it. Even the yanks love the VF SS we exported.

Holden and Toyota had no choice after Ford refused to take the federal governments offer.
The parts suppliers couldn't continue with only 2 manufacturers to supply.

[arronm]

Iam an aussie bloke. So I care about aussie cars. BUT take a good look at the population. Thats why they can sell any old crap...