Scooters - Would you buy one?

[gz1]

just adding a data point here re value of scooters.
Many years ago when I used to live in far north QLD (lovely place would go back there in a tic), I got a used 50cc scooter to commute to work. Approx 10k's each way. Kept the thing for three years, riding it every day, and then sold it when I moved down to Syd, cause there is no way known I would ride any form of two wheel transport with the Sydney Idiot drivers on the roads here. Yep sold on the same day as advertised for exactly what I paid for it three years ago. And it sold so quick I think I would have got more had I asked for more. The price was $800.00 from memory.
So in this case at least zero deprecation in three years. Pretty damn good in my books.
edit: I really do think the key is that magical 50cc or less figure.

[XA Coupsta]

Originally Posted by robbo_yobbo

-thier only as dangerous as the idiot riding, if you ride sensibly, thier perfectly safe, alot more so than a pushbike which people generaly have no quams over saftey on.

No. They are not perfectly safe. No. They are not safer than a pushbike.

Originally Posted by robbo_yobbo

So scooters/motorbikes are no less safe than bicycles, and allot safer than large vehicles which had 47 fatalaties.

Wrong. They are NOT safer than a large vehicle!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by robbo_yobbo

so its fairly safe to assume (based on the documented evidence of SA roads) that scooters riders are less likeley to be in a fatal crash than car drivers.

Again - this one. BLOWN OUT OF THE WATER.

Originally Posted by robbo_yobbo

So percentage is all your after hey. Well based on those results, of all possible causes of death, you are 85% more likeley to be killed in a crash involving a car, than by a crash involving a bike.

And last but not least. You are wrong on this one too.

How many times do you have to be shown what you have posted before and how it has proven to be unequivocally wrong??

No I am not more likely to die in a car crash cause I ride a motorbike EVERY DAY.

There is a groundswell of argument against you Yobbo from myself and others. Open your eyes mate.

[robbo_yobbo]

MAN, you are a true right idiot.

The first 3 quotes you have there all come from the same post that I threw out there for a stir - which if you remember correctly your already aware of - your just obviously ****ed off because you were the only one stupid enough to take the bait!!!! it was the one that says riding a scooter is safer than walking if you remember correctly!!!!!, so dont even bother trying to use quotes from that post to your favour.

Statistics show, the SECOND MOST LIKELEY CAUSE OF DEATH (below suicide) is CAR CRASH ranked at 20% of all unantural deaths. bike crash doesnt even rank in the top ten at around 1.5%.

When comparing only the two (only bike crashes and only car crashes), then cars are actualy closer to 90-95% more likeley compared to 5-10% to bikes (sorry, I calculated the previous 85% from an incorrrect figure you gave me).

Just for a further point, even bike riders are likeley to die in a crash involving a car - that includes you - it doesnt mean you have to be in the car driving it, you could be on your bike, or even walking home from the shops with an arm full of the handbags you just purchased.

You are wrong dude, even the bloke who you thought had you backed up can see why you are wrong, the only reason he initialy backed your argument was because he thought the debate was over a slightly different point, but he saw the light in 2 posts, you are still strugling with it!!!.

[robbo_yobbo]

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

No. They are not safer than a pushbike.

I would also very much like to dispute this point........... (I skimmed over it on the first pass)

Scooters are safer than pushbikes, because.......

Scooters require a 'safer' helmet
Scooters require a liscence meaning users are required to know road rules
Scooters can keep the pace in traffic (thats got to be YOUR favourite reason isnt it?)
Scooters have driving and tail lights
Scooters have indicators (how often do cyclists ever indicate?)
Scooters have STOP lights
Scooters have a loud horn (instead of a ****y bell)
Scooters are easier to dismount in an emergency due to the stepthrough.
Scooter riders wont get fatigued in the way cyclists do, fatigue results in a lack of concentration making you a more dangerous road user

so with that in mind, What the hell makes you think that pushbikes are safer than a scooter in trafic??

Pushbikes normaly have no lights, making them hard to see, and thier actions unpredictable. most cannot keep pace with busy city traffic, and make merging or crossing unsafe for everybody. cyclists wear inferior helmets in comparison, that arent going to prevent allot of damage when hit by a car, and your not going to hear that little warning bell if your radios on, and seeing them comming at night??? doubt it untill its too late.

[robbo_yobbo]

oh, and to add a few more reasons to why scooters are safer than pushbikes...... scooters have to be registered, they carry a rego plate allowing the owner of the vehicle to be identified.

This means that if they are seen doing something unsafe, they can be tracked down..... its allot harder for them to leave the seen of an accident caused by them if they can be identified..... If thier liscence is taken away from them they can no longer ride the scooter.

This means bad road users cannot ride scooters....... But where do all the bad road users that no longer have liscences end up........ On pushbikes, making them even less safe again!

[Neeek]

robbo_yobbo, I can't be bothered to wade back into this argument. Suffice it to say that you still have no grasp of statistics - you seem to have a handle on figures, but not statistics that have any validity.

Please don't make the mistake of thinking that I'm on your side on this one and we're in agreement because nothing could be further from the truth. I was indeed backing up XA Coupsta, and I continue to do so.

You lot can continue this argument if you wish, but I can't be bothered. Over and out!

[XA Coupsta]

Originally Posted by robbo_yobbo

The first 3 quotes you have there all come from the same post that I threw out there for a stir

Try again Einstein. You have lost track of the amount of garbage you have actually posted here im afraid! 1 quote was taken from your famous 'fishing' post. Mind you - you are still arguing what you said in that post anyway - so was it really bait?

Ah whatever.

You are far too smart for all of us Yobbo!

Have a look at your following posts about how you've come to your Scooter Verse Pushbikes debate you've started with yourself.

I mean the whole registered verse unregistered - pure gold mate. Pure gold. Registration sure does make scooters safer. D'oh what was I thinking?! You need to get your work published man you really do.

I mean here I was thinking we were debating safety of Cars V Bikes. I mean the thread is about riding a scooter instead of a car. Even your posts were saying cars are safer. But silly me - now I see that you were saying cars explain 20% of all unnatural causes of death.

Silly me for thinking we were debating Cars V Bikes. We are infact talking about every bloody way to die known to man. Of course!

Sensational! Im just going to sit back and watch the show I think! Im in awe of your intellect Yobbo. Please please share some more of your vast knowledge with us.

[robbo_yobbo]

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

Try again Einstein. You have lost track of the amount of garbage you have actually posted here im afraid! 1 quote was taken from your famous 'fishing' post. Mind you - you are still arguing what you said in that post anyway - so was it really bait?

Ah whatever.

You are far too smart for all of us Yobbo!

Have a look at your following posts about how you've come to your Scooter Verse Pushbikes debate you've started with yourself.

I mean the whole registered verse unregistered - pure gold mate. Pure gold. Registration sure does make scooters safer. D'oh what was I thinking?! You need to get your work published man you really do.

I mean here I was thinking we were debating safety of Cars V Bikes. I mean the thread is about riding a scooter instead of a car. Even your posts were saying cars are safer. But silly me - now I see that you were saying cars explain 20% of all unnatural causes of death.

Silly me for thinking we were debating Cars V Bikes. We are infact talking about every bloody way to die known to man. Of course!

Sensational! Im just going to sit back and watch the show I think! Im in awe of your intellect Yobbo. Please please share some more of your vast knowledge with us.

You idiot - did you bother to read the second post, its said I skimmed over the first quote about pushbikes...... after re-reading, I then posted another post confirming that statement (I should have said "the second two" instead of "the first 3" - the others are al acurate, and I back them)...

We were talking car deaths vs bike deaths. I was (and still am) saying that "DEATH BY CAR ACCIDENT" is far more likeley than "DEATH BY BIKE ACCIDENT", (not "scooters are safer" - I actualy agreed that scooters/bikes are not safer : )........ I put it in the big picture and related it to all possible ways to die just to give you an expanded view of how wrong you are...

Neek, Im not saying your supporting my argument, and I know your intention was to back the coupsta, but at least you realised the actual statement I have been making is correct, and why.... how you relate that to weather or not I have a grasp on relating statistics, Im not sure, but we'll leave that one to another day.

The registration aspect is just one little piece to make up the whole pie - I never said it was the be all and end all, and you obviously ignored the post inbetween with all the other reasons because it doesnt help your side of the debate...... but on that note, why exactly do you think pushbikes are safer...... what exactly do you think they have going for them smarta$$. its one thing to say you think Im wrong, but then you have no reason :

[XA Coupsta]

Yes I am an idiot. All hail king Yobbo!!!

Here I was thinking it was relevant to argue the safety of bikes v cars coz both me, you and the original poster (is considering) riding a bike.

But alas ive come up against the massive intellect of the Yobbo.

So if you dont ride a bike - you arent going to ever die on one are you? So I'd say your chances for dying in a car crash are pretty much better huh?

Silly me thought this key fact was expressed without being written.

Im still learning oh great one!

[XA Coupsta]

Yobbo please help.

I ride a motorbike every Tuesday, a pushbike every Wednesday and Thursday And catch the bus Monday and Friday.

Now I also eat my cereal with a smaller than usual spoon, am allergic to penicillin, and enjoy a cup of coffee every now and then.

Could you please calculate my 'likelyhood' of death by bee sting please?

[Zoink]

Thanks Coupsta your post above has just made my day
Now what I want to know is. What are your chances of dieing from a bee sting while riding a scooter?

[robbo_yobbo]

Originally Posted by Zoink

Thanks Coupsta your post above has just made my day
Now what I want to know is. What are your chances of dieing from a bee sting while riding a scooter?

Higher than being attacked by a shark, but not as high as being killed in a car crash (regardless of which days your on bike, scooter, bus, car, or walking - you can still be killed in a car crash in any of these situations).......

Trivialise it all you want coupsta now that you have obviously (and finaly) discovered the differences in the statements you have been trying to argue, but right is right, and wrong is wrong....... even people that ride scooters as well as drive cars, chances are much higher you will die in a car crash ("a crash involving a car").....

But come on, youve opened up your next debate now....... why do you think pushbikes are safer than scooters???? you say Im wrong, but why??? what reason do you have to say so????

[XA Coupsta]

Oh great Yobbo - can I please ask.......

If you are on a bike, and get hit by a car - is the crash apportioned to a car crash - or a bike crash?

As for your bike question.......

Does it matter if its a BMX or a Mountain Bike?

Or ALL bikes?

[robbo_yobbo]

its appointed to both.......
doesnt matter how much of a smart *** you are, you were still wrong, you didnt consider all the options, so blame yourself rather than trivialise it....

as for bmx or mountain bike, ill take either, or all.... you can pick - just tell me why thier so much safer.

[XA Coupsta]

Yobbo the debate was about safety on a bike verse safety in a car. IF YOU ARE A BIKE RIDER.

You came out with an absolute revelation that general public will more likely die in a car crash.

Well of course they will if they dont ride motorbikes!!! Seriously are you a brain surgeon or rocket scientist for a living?

The relevance was me and you ride motorbikes. The original thread starter was considering riding a bike - hence the debate was to make the original thread starter aware that bikes are more dangerous than cars as he is considering his options.

Then you come out with the general public is more likely to die in a car crash......totally irrelevant to the topic at hand.

So mate talk about bee stings, shark attacks, pushbikes (which you are now on) - the relevance was for Motorbike Safety verse Car Safety - and you were totally outgunned on that topic.

But you will agree that that is what you said all along and basicaly the last 3 pages have been for nothing.

[XA Coupsta]

Now on the pushbike thing Yob.

Does colour matter? So pushbikes of ALL colours are included?

Coz of course Yellow bikes would be safer coz of their visibility.

[robbo_yobbo]

Well, I did try and tell you read the differences in the statements before the debate began to take up an extra 3 pages:

Originally Posted by robbo_yobbo

Think about your argument here and what your actualy trying to convince me of

at that point I was already in agreeance that cars were safer than bikes/scooters, but feelling the need to be right, you decided to argue away without bothering to sit down and think about what you were actualy arguing first...........

yes, I guess yellow pushbikes would be safer than other colours, but still not safer than a scooter, but you tell me what matters, your the one that thinks thier safer...... or have you now decided that your opinion here was probably wrong?????

[bingoTE50]

Whats heavier, a kilo of feathers , or a kilo of sand ?

[Bearman]

Me??? Scooter??? 150kg fat bastard = NO WAY!!!

[robbo_yobbo]

a kilo of feathers is bigger

[XA Coupsta]

Yobbo - the basis of any sound debate is relevance.

Sure - both of us were actually right.

But only one of us was relevant.

Similar to your response above re the kilo of feathers/kilo of sand. So what if the kilo of feathers is bigger! Its totally irrelevant! The simple question was what is heavier - and you even then find a way to take it into a new (unrelated) direction.

[robbo_yobbo]

no we werent both right, I said you were more likeley to die in a car crash, you said you werent. I was right, you were wrong.
sure, what you meant was "your more likeley to suffer a fatal crash while riding a bike than a car", but its not what you said, even if its what you meant, so we werent both right, only I was....

I wrote the feathers were bigger epecting YOU would read it as "heavier" and start another debate about it..... yes this was another fishing expedition and you took the bait again, at least you paid a little more attention this time........I knew you wouldnt be able to help yourself, but just on the relevance side/the whole question was irrelevant anyway, so what does it matter.

[XA Coupsta]

ha ha ha

Mate I hope you feel good about yourself sitting on a computer directing who is right and wrong. You must be lacking in your life Yobbo and I pity you. I really do.

Its really simple. You are obviously very simple yourself. But even so you've missed it entirely. WHOOSH. Hear that noise Yobbo? Thats this thread going over your head.

My only hope is that you dont have kids Yobbo. You really shouldnt be allowed to pollute the gene pool we all swim in.

[XA Coupsta]

ps - been having a bit of a nibble yourslef lately Yobbo.

The pushbike V scooter thing. Bmx, mountain bike or all bikes? Yellow or all colours?

bah ha ha ha

[robbo_yobbo]

I missed nothing, you missed it all, otherwise you wouldnt have persisted.
I only kept up my end because I was right, you now know it, it just took you a while to realise it.
mate, I know colours and types were meant for bait, notice my point was "whats your actual point", I didnt bother disputing any differences for that reason............

So what is your point, why do you say thier so much safer????

I am of the impression you wont actualy give a reason because you dont have one, and you were more interested in taking away from my credibility than having a true point of your own, and now you've realised that your point on the pushbikes being safer than scooters was (just like most of the other points you've raised) actualy not very acurate at all.

But then again, you may just surprise me, Ive given my point on why scooters are safer, the balls back in your court.

[kremmen]

Do crashes on scooters get included into the car crashes section if the riders are only licensed to drive a car, whereas motorcycle crashes are attributed solely to motorcyclists whom are licensed motorcycle riders.

[robbo_yobbo]

nah, 2 wheeled crashes are all attributed in the same group under motorcycles (even some offroad motorcycle deaths)..... I think they also include 4 wheeled old peoples mopeds too which is a bit unfair considering most of those deaths would be heart attack. lol

[XA Coupsta]

Yob.

If you want to start up a Pushbikes V Scooters debate - feel free. But protocol would suggest it would need to be opened up in a new thread.

We dragged this thread kicking and screaming off topic already - so it would seem about time that if you want to go on with it - open up a new thread.

Message board etiquette also usually requires correct spelling in posts. This is something you are yet to address and probably wont - so I cant why you would follow the correct procedure now either.

Whatever floats your boat Mr Right. (oh no - you arent going to now debate Boats V Scooters are you?)

[robbo_yobbo]

Hey,
you made the point to bring it up, no point talking about etiquette now, too late for that.
it only makes sence (to me) that any points raised in the course of discussion for a particular thread, be resolved in that same thread.
Its still directly relevant to scooters which of course is what the thread is about.

Im not going to bother starting it in a new thread, Im honestly not expecting you to come up with anything that can actualy justify your oppinion anyway.

But please, by all means, please, correct me if Im wrong, and if you need to do it in a new thread, just post the link.

And just FYI (even though I know you only mentioned it to patronise) - if you were to make an unjustified statement (relating boats to scooters in the example you used) that I believed to be incorrect, then yes, I would debate it.

[Squalo]

I think the Moderators must be enjoying this exchange, I am

You guys are pretty funny. If you both ever find yourself in Sydney at the same time, please allow me to buy you both a beer...