FORD To Introduce Capped Price Servicing from July 1st..

[WILDB]

I personally think it's a great initiative, it will help prevent nasty surprises and arguments in the service department.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by prydey

the 'fixed price' will also be a 'fixed' list of items. anything extra will incur a charge. make no mistake.

Oh know its crazy, tyres, battery, engines, paint jobs. These should all be included back to the real world.
Get a fixed price from a plumber, or brick layer, or builder or any trades man. Or even a capped price phone account

[roberts]

Originally Posted by WILDB

I personally think it's a great initiative, it will help prevent nasty surprises and arguments in the service department.

ding ding ding, this man gets it, although your could just ask up front how much the service will cost, and if you dont agree dont sign the job card, and leave there should never be an argument if you didn't bother to ask a question.

[WILDB]

I take it you're an advisor/s.manager?

[The G6ET Spot]

Originally Posted by WILDB

That's for a non turbo, check again.

turbo $360, non turbo $255

Originally Posted by WILDB

I take it you're an advisor/s.manager?

I'm not sure what he is. But he certainly needs to go and take a Valium and calm down a little.

[WILDB]

What I meant was the 1 hour service time.

Service time on BA/F Turbos was 1.9, FG is 1.5 from memory.

Then you've got oil, filter and shop supplies/waste disposal which has been set at ~$27.50 for this scheme.

[roberts]

I was harsh but you dont get sugar coating with me I guess I get a little peeved because I do work in the industry, I do really like cars, I dont follow foot ball but if I did I wouldn't join the saint kilda forums and bang on about how much they charge for membership, when the local high school charges me so much less to watch the games. If i genuinely liked the team I would pay to support them, with the thinking the more membership they get the better players they get the more games they win. So saying I was a supporter and not supporting them well that just makes me a poser.

[roberts]

SO, whos team are you on?

[WILDB]

I can understand where you're coming from having worked in a Ford service department previously. (Hence my comment above stating I thought it was a great idea.)

It'll be interesting to see how Ford pushes this......

[XR Martin]

Originally Posted by roberts

Nissan capped serving is to bring back loyalty to there dealerships, something that has been lost through the popularity of car forums where every armchair mechanic has an opinion and a complaint.
It means the servicing cost are capped across every dealership across Australia so customers will call around and get the same price for the same car for the same service, sort of like your big mac, should be the same price at every Mcdonalds and I guess if its not then Im sure there is a Mcdonalds forum for these types of consumers to make there complaints about costs.

Toyota came up with the Fixed price serving when they started the express servicing (2 techs working on the one car on the one hoist at the same time they are trained by toyota to carry out these services in the least amount of time, the way this was calculated was by hooking 2 techs up to a gps tracking device and watched where they walked and what things they did in a certain order when carrying out different services on different models and a toyota brain looked at the info and worked out the fastest possible way from point A to finish)
When having a toyota fixed price service, you have nothing other then the bare minimum done to your car if its not in the book then its not touched, no washer additive, no engine oil flush, no injectors cleaner, power steering oil will never be changed, just enough to get the customer through the 3 year or 60,000 km's when the fixed price service stops, this is the hope that to driver will want a new car by this time and buy another toyota . Toyotas are hugely simple to service and the 2 techs can do these "pitstop" services in about 15mins, the serving cost still comes over the fixed price, and the rest is charged back to Toyota warranty department.

Im sure ford will be going down the same track as Nissan to bring some trust back to the dealerships, like I said earlier Chinese whispers across the internet has made this a reality.
Hope i cleared any miss conceptions.

Why does a new car need an oil flush? You and I know its a scam and its up there with paint protection. Sure if the car has done 30k without a service then recommend the flush, but at a regular service intervals its completely unnecessary. Washer additive? Also unnecessary. How much do you charge for what is basically a squirt of dishwashing liquid?
Power steering fluid? That shouldnt need changing until 100k.

[WILDB]

Washer additive is normally less than $2 (if even charged for) at the dealerships I've worked for.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Why does a new car need an oil flush? You and I know its a scam and its up there with paint protection. Sure if the car has done 30k without a service then recommend the flush, but at a regular service intervals its completely unnecessary. Washer additive? Also unnecessary. How much do you charge for what is basically a squirt of dishwashing liquid?
Power steering fluid? That shouldnt need changing until 100k.

yes washer additive is not expensive and most find it very necessary your standards may not ne to a brand new car level, but its a nicer touch than some dirty tap water in a brand new car, engine flush it cant hurt pulling all the old oil out and starting fresh. Once you have had the power steering fluid flushed with good fluid you will swear its a different car I would say more like 60,000 then 100 depending how its driven and type of car. Anyone can drop the fat in the drive way but we are not talking 180b's here.
trust me when I say the little JoeBlow mechanical shops will do anything to have you coming back that why he pretends to be your best mate, like hes all in the know about those scamming dealerships. He doesn't care about you or your car do you think a dealership has more at stake to service the car to a higher standard I think so, fact is without a dealership service and parts department, JoeBlow would be out of business because dealerships will be out of business.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by roberts

Go buy a holden

Already got one champ

[roberts]

Anyone who hasn't used and engine flush should, especially if it diesel, just try it the bottles are like $15 small price to pay for preventative maintenance, injector cleaner too the amount of cars Iv seen with problems due to bad fuel, o2 sensor's, engine lights, blowing smoke, fuel pumps, injectors for $15 it seems worth it to me not everyone uses 98 octane and even then you can get bad 98.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

Already got one champ

which engine?

[burnz]

Originally Posted by roberts

blah blah every post i hate holden, don't service or half supply the dealer with your oil...waffle

ford fixed price:: worth it or not???

[roberts]

Originally Posted by burnz

ford fixed price:: worth it or not???

every cent

[drew`SEVNT5]

Mate of mine put his G6ET in for its 30,000km service, at a place where 'they look after him cos they know him'... He used to put all his work cars thru there at a previous employer.

$470.

[ltd]

Simple facts are, dealer servicing is your guarantee that should something go wrong in the warranty period, you're more likely to be looked after.
Take these two scenarios to compare.

Scenario 1: FG XR6 Turbo comes in with a blown turbo, and the owner Dave goes to his regular ford dealership who knows him, his car and has stamped his book with regular services.
Dealer: What happened Dave?
Dave: Well, it was driving like normal, then all of a sudden I heard a grinding sound and then a bang
Dealer: Has the car been modified?
Dave: Not really, just an exhaust and air filter
Dealer: Alright, shouldn't be a problem.
Dave gets the car fixed as the dealer explains to Ford warranty that the car is regularly serviced there. Dealer is asked to check if it has been flash tuned, he checks and assures them it's not. The car is authorised to be repaired.

Scenario 2: Same as scenario 1 however Dave not a regular.
Dealer: Hi, what's the problem?
Dave: Don't know, I heard a grinding noise and then a bang and it's way down on power so I had it towed here.
Dealer: Where do you usually get it serviced?
Dave: Sometimes Ultratune, other times I do it myself
Dealer: Have you got the service book stamped for every service?
Dave: Most of them.
Dealer: I don't think ford will approve it. We'll try though.
Dave: They better approve it or I'll go to consumer affairs
Dealer: Leave it with us.

Dealer talks to Melbourne regarding the warranty:
Dealer: we've got an FG XR6T with a blown turbo, VIN 6FPAAA........
MW: Has it been regularly serviced?
Dealer: His book has missed a couple of stamps but Ultratune has stamped most of them. The ones missed he did himself.
MW: So not all there?
Dealer: No.
MW: Has the vehicle been modified?
Dealer: Looks like an exhaust and filter.
MW: Check the PCM for flash tuning
Dealer: We did, came up negative
MW: Hmm. We'll review and get back to you.
Next day, MW calls dealer
MW: We've reviewed, we believe the vehicle is likely to have been flash tuned and modified, has a bad service history and we feel we're in a solid position to deny the claim.
Dealer calls Dave: Sorry, but the warranty claim is denied.
Dave: &^*%^&%*%^%^&*%^&$*%$$$#$(&*&*(*
Dealer: What would you like us to do?
Dave: &^(& off. I'm taking it to Fair Trading you lousy $#&#%^.

Fair Trading: Sorry, but after reviewing the evidence of both the dealership, Ford Motor Company and your unsatisfactory meeting of Ford's terms and conditions for warranty we find in favour of Ford Motor Company; your claim denied.

Seems far fetched, but this actually happened although I changed it from an F6 to an XR6T to keep all innocent parties out of it.

Also, I'm a little confused about some of the attitudes of people here regarding fluids.
Engine oil flush? Of course it's a good thing. There's lots of additives in oil and frankly when they get hot, they can glaze surfaces. Oil flush is a must.
Coolant? I've heard of people buying long life and leaving it in for 4 years. Are you guys crazy? Think of all the additives in those and how many cycles of high temperature it's exposed to. As it breaks down those additives are separating from the coolant and guaranteed are blocking small galleries as I type this. Nucking Futs guys. If the colour of your coolant has started to change from Kermit the frog green, it's way past its use by date. Check this video out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0urT-...eature=related

As for filters; Motorcraft only if you like your warranty. I've seen ryco filters blow off the old windsor V8's because they aren't double welded at the plate. Do you guys know how many seized V8's were denied warranty back in the late 90's?

In summary, Ford service may not be the cheapest, but if something goes wrong or you have an accident as a result of their workmanship you're covered - as opposed to elsewhere where the technicians and owners run for cover.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by ltd

Simple facts are, dealer servicing is your guarantee that should something go wrong in the warranty period, you're more likely to be looked after.
Take these two scenarios to compare.

Scenario 1: FG XR6 Turbo comes in with a blown turbo, and the owner Dave goes to his regular ford dealership who knows him, his car and has stamped his book with regular services.
Dealer: What happened Dave?
Dave: Well, it was driving like normal, then all of a sudden I heard a grinding sound and then a bang
Dealer: Has the car been modified?
Dave: Not really, just an exhaust and air filter
Dealer: Alright, shouldn't be a problem.
Dave gets the car fixed as the dealer explains to Ford warranty that the car is regularly serviced there. Dealer is asked to check if it has been flash tuned, he checks and assures them it's not. The car is authorised to be repaired.

Scenario 2: Same as scenario 1 however Dave not a regular.
Dealer: Hi, what's the problem?
Dave: Don't know, I heard a grinding noise and then a bang and it's way down on power so I had it towed here.
Dealer: Where do you usually get it serviced?
Dave: Sometimes Ultratune, other times I do it myself
Dealer: Have you got the service book stamped for every service?
Dave: Most of them.
Dealer: I don't think ford will approve it. We'll try though.
Dave: They better approve it or I'll go to consumer affairs
Dealer: Leave it with us.

Dealer talks to Melbourne regarding the warranty:
Dealer: we've got an FG XR6T with a blown turbo, VIN 6FPAAA........
MW: Has it been regularly serviced?
Dealer: His book has missed a couple of stamps but Ultratune has stamped most of them. The ones missed he did himself.
MW: So not all there?
Dealer: No.
MW: Has the vehicle been modified?
Dealer: Looks like an exhaust and filter.
MW: Check the PCM for flash tuning
Dealer: We did, came up negative
MW: Hmm. We'll review and get back to you.
Next day, MW calls dealer
MW: We've reviewed, we believe the vehicle is likely to have been flash tuned and modified, has a bad service history and we feel we're in a solid position to deny the claim.
Dealer calls Dave: Sorry, but the warranty claim is denied.
Dave: &^*%^&%*%^%^&*%^&$*%$$$#$(&*&*(*
Dealer: What would you like us to do?
Dave: &^(& off. I'm taking it to Fair Trading you lousy $#&#%^.

Fair Trading: Sorry, but after reviewing the evidence of both the dealership, Ford Motor Company and your unsatisfactory meeting of Ford's terms and conditions for warranty we find in favour of Ford Motor Company; your claim denied.

Seems far fetched, but this actually happened although I changed it from an F6 to an XR6T to keep all innocent parties out of it.

Also, I'm a little confused about some of the attitudes of people here regarding fluids.
Engine oil flush? Of course it's a good thing. There's lots of additives in oil and frankly when they get hot, they can glaze surfaces. Oil flush is a must.
Coolant? I've heard of people buying long life and leaving it in for 4 years. Are you guys crazy? Think of all the additives in those and how many cycles of high temperature it's exposed to. As it breaks down those additives are separating from the coolant and guaranteed are blocking small galleries as I type this. Nucking Futs guys. If the colour of your coolant has started to change from Kermit the frog green, it's way past its use by date. Check this video out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0urT-...eature=related

As for filters; Motorcraft only if you like your warranty. I've seen ryco filters blow off the old windsor V8's because they aren't double welded at the plate. Do you guys know how many seized V8's were denied warranty back in the late 90's?

In summary, Ford service may not be the cheapest, but if something goes wrong or you have an accident as a result of their workmanship you're covered - as opposed to elsewhere where the technicians and owners run for cover.

well said
Iv heard the consumer affairs thing so much I started handing out the number to call them, Never been in the wrong. Some people think the warranty for there car starts and stops at the dealership, if a repair is done and the manufacture decide to reject the claim then the dealership cops the bill, something a dealership will do for a customer with good service history if its a grey area and you have poor service history forget it.

Something capped servicing will allow a consumer to do when buying a new car, work out the price of the model you want and work out how long you plan to keep it for. Add the costs for the servicing up over the time you plan to own it, crunch the numbers and if you cant afford to service the car correctly, buy a cheaper model that you can afford. eg: dont get a f6 if you only have focus money. There is also the lease option, but lease cars get the bare minimum done, no preventative maintenance, when you have a lease car you never really own it anyway so as long as your changing them over every couple of years it shouldn't bother you and the person that buys that lease car at auction is getting something with poor service history booked stamped or not, but you get what you pay for.

The people that get it all wrong are the ones that buy a used car with like one year warranty on it, service it a ultra tune or JOEBLOWS autos, they scream blue murder when they have to pay for a rattle to be fixed

[rayner22]

I think a lot of service advisors need to learn the hard way that there is no legal demand under Australian consumer law for a car to be serviced by the manufacturer. If you stick to the services as set out by the manufacturer in the logbook, legally there can be no dispute of warranty validity.
Seen it through others and done it myself.
The Ford dealer I bought my XR from refused to fix a few common problems and one arising from their shoddy pre-delivery, under warranty because they had not done the last two services. This on a car with 30 000 on the clock. After a phone call to Ford CR and a visit to Consumer Affairs, they quickly folded.

[prydey]

ltd - that story has a lot of holes in it. i'm guessing you kept it breif to get your point across.

if you miss a service, i'm not sure why you still expect ford or any manufacturer to honour your warranty. you know the score when you buy the car, so if you decide you'll save a couple of bob and service it yourself, then you do run the risk of being knocked back for warranty.

[rayner22]

Originally Posted by prydey

if you miss a service, i'm not sure why you still expect ford or any manufacturer to honour your warranty. you know the score when you buy the car, so if you decide you'll save a couple of bob and service it yourself, then you do run the risk of being knocked back for warranty.

Totally agree, if you can't produce a logbook with a stamp showing ABN, MTA number etc you're well.. screwed.

Bit like if I went and serviced my own aircon unit (not trade qualified but do work in the aircon industry) and something went wrong a week later, I severely doubt Daikin would come to the party lol

[roberts]

Originally Posted by rayner22

I think a lot of service advisors need to learn the hard way that there is no legal demand under Australian consumer law for a car to be serviced by the manufacturer. If you stick to the services as set out by the manufacturer in the logbook, legally there can be no dispute of warranty validity.
Seen it through others and done it myself.
The Ford dealer I bought my XR from refused to fix a few common problems and one arising from their shoddy pre-delivery, under warranty because they had not done the last two services. This on a car with 30 000 on the clock. After a phone call to Ford CR and a visit to Consumer Affairs, they quickly folded.

Service advisers and service managers don't decided what is warranty and what is not, most service departments will have an warranty officer that deals directly with the manufacture and lodges the claims for reimbursement.

the law and what others have done a completely different things, sometimes a dealership will cover the costs to make a customer happy, the same goes with the manufacture, in a perfect world your car would never have to be serviced and it would never break down, but people don't have a $1000,000 to spend on a car now do they. They can make tyre's that never run out but the same, people cant afford them. It a juggling act to say the least to make people happy at a price they can afford. Everyone can afford a different price but the customer expectations are about the same.
I think if you buy a car and take it to the same dealer you brought the car from for servicing than the chances of having any claim knocked back is close to zero, even when out of warranty. Anything else is a grey area, but then it comes down to price and customers will buy a car from a dealer that isn't convenient for them to take for servicing to save a few bucks off the purchase price.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by rayner22

I think a lot of service advisors need to learn the hard way that there is no legal demand under Australian consumer law for a car to be serviced by the manufacturer. If you stick to the services as set out by the manufacturer in the logbook, legally there can be no dispute of warranty validity.
Seen it through others and done it myself.
The Ford dealer I bought my XR from refused to fix a few common problems and one arising from their shoddy pre-delivery, under warranty because they had not done the last two services. This on a car with 30 000 on the clock. After a phone call to Ford CR and a visit to Consumer Affairs, they quickly folded.

if it was something that happened at pre-delivery why did you wait 30,000 to have it fixed. This was not a warranty claim this is a policy claim where the selling dealer covers the cost, heads up there is no such thing as common problems in any manufactures eyes, if it is they recall it. You got what you wanted because you complained enough, silence that squeaky wheel ford would say. This doesn't make a warranty claim and the selling dealer probably copped the bill.

I cant help but notice that you would have not had an issue if you just serviced it with the dealership, how much of your time did you spend arguing at the service department, then on the phone to ford CR then the trip to consumer affairs, half a day a day maybe. Whats a full days pay worth to you? Are you really saving money or just doing things the hard way

[rayner22]

Originally Posted by roberts

if it was something that happened at pre-delivery why did you wait 30,000 to have it fixed. This was not a warranty claim this is a policy claim where the selling dealer covers the cost, heads up there is no such thing as common problems in any manufactures eyes, if it is they recall it. You got what you wanted because you complained enough, silence that squeaky wheel ford would say. This doesn't make a warranty claim and the selling dealer probably copped the bill.

I cant help but notice that you would have not had an issue if you just serviced it with the dealership, how much of your time did you spend arguing at the service department, then on the phone to ford CR then the trip to consumer affairs, half a day a day maybe. Whats a full days pay worth to you? Are you really saving money or just doing things the hard way

How about the idea that it took 30 000kms for the area where the problem was to become a problem because of eventual failure?? And it was more to the fact the dealer did not want the fact they had stuffed up a basic part of pre delivery and therefore jeopardised a major suspension component on a new car known to Ford HQ, by denying there was a genuine warranty claim on the other issues of the car in the hope I would "go away".

Considering the offending dealer when the issue was raised tried to say there was no issue at all despite the fact a blind man could have seen it, I'd hate to see what other problems they could have caused in the two services they did not perform.

Ford CR however were great to deal with and I actually had a senior manager deal with the issue to make sure it was sorted and never allowed to happen again. Time spent by me - 10-20 mins on the phone to Geelong, and 10 mins on the phone to Cons Affairs to find out my rights = I didn't fork out the hefty repair figure.

No common problems bud?? How about you go look around in the B-series or any other section for that matter and open your eyes??
Unless it is a OBVIOUS safety issue, most manufacturers fail to issue a recall based on sheer economical cost of performing repairs to 1000's of vehicles alone. Has Ford issued a recall for BA\BF diff bushes?? HIM mixer shaft?? 4spd auto heat exchanger?? Crap brake rotors since God knows when?? And don't even start any of us on the amount of non-recalled dramas Holden, Toyota etc have.

If it wasn't for all of us being blue blooded, we'd never be able to oversee such things.

You might work in the industry bud, but don't believe the corporate world's opinion of things you have had forced into your brain. Real world works different.

Can we get it back on topic now before we unduely stress out a moderator??

[FASTXR]

Just awaiting delivery on a Mitsubishi Challenger 4WD and have been reading the Mitsubishi fixed price servicing info.

The Challenger (which has the Triton engine and gearbox) is $580 per standard service; as mentioned earlier, Triton is $590!

Not only do I find it baffling as to how a standard service can cost nearly $600, but I'm also staggered at the difference between service costs for a Triton 2WD petrol and diesel. Petrol costs $215 per service compared to $590 for the diesel!! Now I'll be the first to admit that I'm not a diesel expert, but $375 difference in cost?? This is part of the reason people are going elsewhere to have their servicing done.

Oh, and Mitsubishis come with 5 years roadside assist, but if you read the fine print you'll notice that this is only valid after year 1 if you have at least one factory service performed each year.

[2011G6E]

I'm taking the G6E in for it's 15,000km service on tuesday...apparently it's going to cost about $340.

Not a bad price for a simple oil change and a general quick check over...
We missed out on the "fixed price servicing" by a few months. Anyone know what the other services are likely to be with our "normal" servicing plan?

I'll only really be bringing up one item as a question: the "Edge" paint, while a magnificent colour, seems to be laid on awfully thin to our car...the littlest nudge or rub and you're left with a mark or a scratch down to the primer. I wish we hadn't sprung for the "paint protection" now...

When we had our 2004 4.2 turbo diesel Landcruiser, the "minor service" (at 10,000km intervals between major services) was $420 or so, and the "major" (every 20,000km) service was a staggering $1000...yes, every 20,000km...

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I'm taking the G6E in for it's 15,000km service on tuesday...apparently it's going to cost about $340.

Not a bad price for a simple oil change and a general quick check over...
We missed out on the "fixed price servicing" by a few months. Anyone know what the other services are likely to be with our "normal" servicing plan?

Try another dealer. I have one that is grossly overpriced. Then I have the one that I use that's cheaper (and a lot more competent) then the Ultratune around here.

[WILDB]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I'm taking the G6E in for it's 15,000km service on tuesday...apparently it's going to cost about $340.

Not a bad price for a simple oil change and a general quick check over...
We missed out on the "fixed price servicing" by a few months. Anyone know what the other services are likely to be with our "normal" servicing plan?

You'll still be in the capped price servicing scheme, it applies to ALL vehicles built since 2007.