**GM preparing for bankruptcy**

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Oh bother, do Bosch manufacture locally? And as for PBR, maybe Ford should start thinking about a different brake supplier? Many people think the brakes on BA/BF were rubbish and it's only a matter of time before we find out about FG's.......

Yup. Ford have used them for components since God was a Girl, and today, they make bits from (and correct me if I'm wrong here) the Composite Inlet Manifold, to the ABS/Traction Control/DSC, and other electrics. Fortunately, for Bosch Australia, they export many, many components as well.

Edit: Keelan - There's a couple of European mules running around now. Don't expect to see many here, until they are built here, as all the engineering is going to be done in Europe.

[Swordsman88]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Edit: Keelan - There's a couple of European mules running around now. Don't expect to see many here, until they are built here, as all the engineering is going to be done in Europe.

yeah i figured Andrew. I wonder if Ford aus will have a more significant role (well they don't do anything in focus now anyway) this time though. In terms of local development testing of European designed stuff. Ride/handling with local tunes would also be good. I'm not saying the ford europe guys are crap we all know they aren't, they are FWD masters. But, would be nice to have a little local input since its coming down our line.

I suppose its too much to ask that Focus RS Revoknuckle or a version of is in the new Focus. That is a pretty nifty engineering trick to reduct torque steer.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

As long as Holden helps GM more than it hurts it (small losses here in the grand scheme of things) then GM might, stress might be able to keep holden going by using US gov. money (though that would be politically a problem for obama). As for Holden itself, well it has bigger problems in its lineup than some DoD, ethanol and a Daewoo designed astra knock off in local production.

One of the stipulations of GM getting US Government bailout money is that none of it is to be used to help prop up foreign entities, and none of it is to be spent outside of the US.

Holden have said that GM has kept money for them to make the small car here, but the only money they have is the money the US Government gave them to keep them going. Holden should be very worried, they might not even get the money. If the choice came down to use the money to help keep GM going, or to give to Holden to make the small car the choice will be an easy one for GM to make.

[robertjp]

GM ordered to prepare for bankruptcy

Anyone seen this and wonder how wheels / carsguide will react, yeah we know this is a golden opportunity for GMH.

Robert.

[4Vman]

The end is near.....

[Daymoe]

Originally Posted by robertjp

GM ordered to prepare for bankruptcy

Anyone seen this and wonder how wheels / carsguide will react, yeah we know this is a golden opportunity for GMH.

Robert.

They might have to change their bias from Holden to Ford!

[robjh80]

Originally Posted by Daymoe

They might have to change their bias from Holden to Ford!

That'll never happen .... Holden to Daewoo maybe yea! ..

[ebxr8240]

Originally Posted by robjh80

That'll never happen .... Holden to Daewoo maybe yea! ..

Whats the difference??
Same thing !!...

[Daymoe]

Originally Posted by ebxr8240

Whats the difference??
Same thing !!...

They're all screwed!

[bigdude1011]

Originally Posted by robjh80

Holden to Daewoo maybe yea! ..

If they exist... Though I would expect it to move across to Toyota

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by robertjp

Anyone seen this and wonder how wheels / carsguide will react, yeah we know this is a golden opportunity for GMH.

Robert.

It would go like this.

"Holden's parent company has moved to secure it future today by signing an agreement with the banks. The downturn in economy has ment that sales are low, and that there is fear of job losses through out.

Ford have made no similer plans as of yet, and the falcon struggled to sell over 3000 units last month."

[cool65]

Someone predicting no more holden with ford just behind

Crisis means curtains for Holden: expert

Australia's car industry will not survive the economic recession, and Holden will probably be the first to go, an industry expert says.

Editor of the car buyers Dog & Lemon Guide, Clive Matthew-Wilson, said the Australian car manufacturer is poised to shut down for good because it can no longer compete in the global market.

Holden signalled the beginning of the end when it recently halved production at its South Australian plant, he said.

In early April the company announced that from May 4 it will reduce production at its Adelaide plant from about 600 vehicles a day to 310, citing reduced demand in domestic and export markets.

"Australia's car factories are losing money on every vehicle they make," Mr Matthew-Wilson said in a statement.

"No amount of incentives from the state and federal governments can solve this basic problem.

"It's not a matter of whether they close down, but when they close down."

He said Holden will be the first to go, followed by Ford and then Toyota.Crisis means curtains for Holden: expert

[BigAL_250]

How about we see the rest of that article:

Straight back to the normal dribble, media in this country just can't accept that for the first time in decades Ford is doing better (relatively) than it's red counterpart.

-----------------------------------------
"People falsely believe that Ford is doing okay. That's not true," he said.

"American Ford's sales are down 43 per cent in the first quarter of this year.

"Ford is losing billions just like GM; it's just that Ford arranged private sector finance before the recession, so it's not quite so obvious how serious things are."

Amid the financial turmoil, the big three US car makers - Ford, Chrysler and Holden owner General Motors - have asked the US government for a loan guarantee of $US25 billion ($37.51 billion). [Ahh... what the, isn't this the loan Ford didn't take]

Earlier this year Toyota, the world's No.1 car maker and Australian market leader, accepted a $35 million federal government grant to build a hybrid version of its four-cylinder Camry sedan in Melbourne from 2010.

But Mr Matthew-Wilson said the money is a waste.

"Globally, there's a glut of new cars at bargain prices, yet Australia, which produces a small number of high cost cars, is trying to compete with countries like China, which produces ten million cars a year and pays its car workers as little as one dollar per hour.

"The Australian government can throw $6 billion or $600 billion at these car plants, but they still won't be economically feasible," he said.

"Australia's car plants are losing money faster than a drunk at a casino and there's no feasible way of turning this around.

"The Australian car industry can re-focus on small cars, green cars, blue cars or red cars. None of this will make the slightest difference."

Mr Matthew-Wilson believes the government money would have been better spent by giving it to the affected car workers.
------------------------------------------------

[Scott]

Originally Posted by bigal_250

"People falsely believe that Ford is doing okay. That's not true," he said."

I don't think too many people think Ford are doing ok - much less people at Ford. I certainly think that if Ford can hang on, they are better placed than the others though.

[banarcus]

There wont be a little saviour car for Holden. They need the cash from GM but of course the american taxpayer will not let them have it to prop up a factory supplying a tiny market. Within the next 2 weeks, Holden will be put up for sale. Sad times indeed.

[Ohio XB]

The 2011 next gen Focus is scheduled to be built and go on sale in the US next year, possibly May-August span I would presume.


As for how Ford is doing......providing they can hang on until the upswing in the market, just like all the other manufacturers are waiting for, they are going to kick ***.

Evidence of confidence in this is all the bondholders that happily took Ford stock and cash at 40 cents on the dollar in trade for debt. Ford had more takers than they wanted and closed the deal in 2 weeks.

Evidently these people (business professionals) feel they are going to get a good return on the Ford stock (which is up 400% since December).

Add to that parity with transplant companies on labor costs, removing $10 billion in debt, the most 5 star safety rated vehicles in the US, the most "recommended buys" by Consumer Reports (70%), quality equal to or better than Toyota and Honda, new products across 80% of the product line, new styling, new engines with better fuel economy and emissions, rave reviews from automotive journalists, praise among Americans for not taking a government loan.....and MORE!!! Ford is poised. Ford is ready and equipped. Ford is at the top of their game like never before.

This is not the company I hired into, this is much, much better!


Steve

[imugli]

Any indications on US sales so far this month Steve?

Word was they saw a bottoming in March - has this proven true so far?

[Phyber]

Makes me wanna buy Ford stocks! I like your take on things Steve. Good name too, I oughta know hahaha.

Feels good to drive a Ford, but even better now.

[Unco]

sorry, but are you coming here to ask for trading advice?

and you're asking if you should invest in Ford stocks?

Seriously, what do you think?

and on that note. considering all of the above (the fact that you're coming to a public forum testing for trading advice). how do you think your trading is going to go?

[Phyber]

I'm not buying any stocks at all don't worry! Not much of a gambler myself, and the idea of all your money going *poof* overnight doesn't sit well with me. Just giving props to a positive comment is all

[Wally]

Isn't the newest kid in the socialist block going to swap debt for equity in GM? The idea being the FunkyNewGM would be owned by current bond holders, unions and the US Govt while CrustyOldGM would go down along with it's non performing lines and recalcitrant unsecured creditors.

Another bold move by Chairman Obama the Federated Peoples Republic of America citizenry.

[imugli]

Originally Posted by Wally

Isn't the newest kid in the socialist block going to swap debt for equity in GM? The idea being the FunkyNewGM would be owned by current bond holders, unions and the US Govt while CrustyOldGM would go down along with it's non performing lines and recalcitrant unsecured creditors.

Another bold move by Chairman Obama the Federated Peoples Republic of America citizenry.

Yep. You can read about it here

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Wally

Isn't the newest kid in the socialist block going to swap debt for equity in GM? The idea being the FunkyNewGM would be owned by current bond holders, unions and the US Govt while CrustyOldGM would go down along with it's non performing lines and recalcitrant unsecured creditors.

Another bold move by Chairman Obama the Federated Peoples Republic of America citizenry.

And the alternative is what........... Mmmmmmm ?

Oh yeah.....you and you family are not affected by this debacle.....

Stop with the political rubbish and understand what is going on here..

[Wally]

I understand more than you obviously. I actually own a business and employ many people...profitably. I don't get handouts, I fight the good fight everyday.... everyday, 365 days a years for the last 30 odd years. I make sure I pay ny people very well, I take an interest in the employees families, I donate probably as much as you earn in a year to charity, I mentor young engineers and apprentices. I'm a Godammned legend in my own mind.

The alternative you are asking about is to let the company run it's course, just like any other business has to. The heartache of failure, the fear of debt, the loyalty to employees, these are all weights that responsible business owners carry. Of course I'm affected, but I'm not myopic.

What do you bring to the table that makes you so cocksure you know who I am and what I know? Tell us how you are a success in business and all things economic that gives you a unique insight into why a foreign govt should nationalise it's industry... Germany 1934? Your occupation certainly doesn't point to anything that resembles the qualifications necessary to make judgements about other members, so why do you think you have the right to lambast others?

[ILLaViTaR]

Originally Posted by Wally

I understand more than you obviously. I actually own a business and employ many people...profitably. I don't get handouts, I fight the good fight everyday.... everyday, 365 days a years for the last 30 odd years. I make sure I pay ny people very well, I take an interest in the employees families, I donate probably as much as you earn in a year to charity, I mentor young engineers and apprentices. I'm a Godammned legend in my own mind.

The alternative you are asking about is to let the company run it's course, just like any other business has to. The heartache of failure, the fear of debt, the loyalty to employees, these are all weights that responsible business owners carry. Of course I'm affected, but I'm not myopic.

What do you bring to the table that makes you so cocksure you know who I am and what I know? Tell us how you are a success in business and all things economic that gives you a unique insight into why a foreign govt should nationalise it's industry... Germany 1934? Your occupation certainly doesn't point to anything that resembles the qualifications necessary to make judgements about other members, so why do you think you have the right to lambast others?

Ah the good old I'm a hero/the world would be far worse off without me capitalist ego.

Reality check:

1. You perks/benefits of owning a business outweigh anything with the word handout in it.

2. Instead of boasting blind sums why don't we look at the percentage of your income you donate rather than the amount. And if you weren't blessed with all this income I doubt you'd be donating in the first place.

3. The reason those charities don't have money in the first place is because capitalists have a monopoly on the market and take advantage of it, hoard all the money which results in a majority suffering for the minority.
An example of this would be the oil companies, the price for petrol is ridiculously steep for the average family, causes lots of grief/stress, all because someone wants to have a diamond coated Mercedes Benz.

No matter how ruthless you are, you supply jobs and donate to charity and once that happens you're a hero.

I'll probably get executed for treason tomorrow, note however that government decision will be heavily influenced by some capitalist.

[Ohio XB]

Where do all the capitalists come from?


If you're not working for yourself (would working for yourself make you a capitalist?) or someone else, who else do you work for? The government that pays you with your own taxes that they have to raise if they are going to pay you more?



Steve

[Ohio XB]

Originally Posted by imugli

Any indications on US sales so far this month Steve?

Word was they saw a bottoming in March - has this proven true so far?

I'll see what I can find, but we are only 1/2 way into April. The Ford Advantage Plan should be boosting sales though.


Steve

[Wally]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

Ah the good old I'm a hero/the world would be far worse off without me capitalist ego.

Reality check:

1. You perks/benefits of owning a business outweigh anything with the word handout in it.

2. Instead of boasting blind sums why don't we look at the percentage of your income you donate rather than the amount. And if you weren't blessed with all this income I doubt you'd be donating in the first place.

3. The reason those charities don't have money in the first place is because capitalists have a monopoly on the market and take advantage of it, hoard all the money which results in a majority suffering for the minority.
An example of this would be the oil companies, the price for petrol is ridiculously steep for the average family, causes lots of grief/stress, all because someone wants to have a diamond coated Mercedes Benz.

No matter how ruthless you are, you supply jobs and donate to charity and once that happens you're a hero.

I'll probably get executed for treason tomorrow, note however that government decision will be heavily influenced by some capitalist.

Once again you know very little about me...how could you? My retort was not so much at Barraxr8, but the need for some members to rdicule others to promote their own agendas. Your post for instance could be construed as the working man's mantra. I don't have a problem with you thinking in terms of evil capitalists and wholesome socialists, that is your right, but if I disagreed I wouldn't be segueing a disassociated spin on your posts like you have on mine.

My post was a swipe at the home of capitalism moving toward a protectionist/socialist model that was the USA from 1812 through to 1919. You would know about this from your highschool social studies B. You would also know the outcome of the tariff centric US Govt nationalising manufacture and finance in the 1920'/30's and other countries following suit?

Humour me a bit on your points:

1 What perks do you think a business owner gets? We aren't talking a listed corporation here that spends shareholder's money on american or english accents.

2. I have done charity work since I was a kid growing up in the worst part of Perth... your excuse? If being generous to others is a sin, then I'm guilty as charged.

3. The reason charities don't have enough money is because the donations aren't enough. Are you doing your bit? Oil companies hoarding the world's money supply causing a lack of donations is drawing a pretty long bow.

And no I'm not a hero. On the contrary I'm quite self deprecating; it's the Mrs Haversham's of this world who put labels on people they don't know or won't bend to their will.

[Deech]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

1. You perks/benefits of owning a business outweigh anything with the word handout in it.

Like the perk where you get to outlay, say, $100k in start-up costs, then on the first day, sell maybe $1000 in goods or services, followed by spending more than that on wages, taxes, insurances, repayments on the $100k business loan followed by the million other costs associated in making your negative ~$110k profit for the day, while working harder than any of your employees?
This is before going home to lay awake at night, pooing cinder blocks thinking about how you're going to pay back those ever-growing debts, while spending the same as everyone else keeping your family fed, car going and mortgage paid?
Then repeat the process for a very long time before you can even begin to breathe, let alone make a healthy profit margin, before being branded a horrible capitalist in the expert eyes of the 20-something employee you took a chance on in the first place? I'm definitely jealous of that perk.

I'm probably from a similar background to you. Truth be told, I'm in my 20's (yep, Generation Y), study full time, and get my money by working for a smallish -under 20 employees- company that now turns a healthy profit. I'm well aware of the fact my boss drives a much nicer car, and lives in a much nicer house than I.
I do however think my boss, like all small business owners, is the salt of the earth to have stuck his neck out so far to provide me an opportunity to work, earn money and generally have much smaller things to worry about.

Ever heard the expression; "Fortune favours the bold"?

[Wally]

You are destined to go a long way Deech... alas the slings and arrows of the uneducated, narrow minded and the lazy.