Road expert says why we need faster speed limits

[Tom Tucker]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Can you tell us how we identify this weak, disadvantaged, minority.

They're the ones in the left lane.

I'm sure you appreciate the wider philosophical argument here.

[burnz]

Originally Posted by Tom Tucker

They're the ones in the left lane.

I'm sure you appreciate the wider philosophical argument here.

ha ha I'm always in the left lane, because it's the fastest lane.

[Mowdit]

As Burnz says
The left lane is often less congested, particularly on 3 lane roads

Too often you see people who not only can't merge, but who seem to think the left lane is a transit lane or something and insist on jumping straight into the right lane

WTF, all they do is cut off some poor bugger, who then brakes (causing the domino effect) and makes the fast lane SLOW

Using calculator that the RTA/RMS use they will never raise the limit, its possible to drive at 150 in places, but would you do it knowing Mr Magoo is coming the other way

I will continue to drive like Mark Webber

In the left lane

[Ross 1]

It's the love of the fast lane by people doing below the speed limit that will doom this to failure. Have driven in Germany and been a passenger in the UAE, if you aren't going fast enough the car behind simply flashes its lights and everyone politely moves over, sometimes even with a wave of acknowledgement. I just cannot imagine the average Sydney driving being able to take the blow to his or her ego and move over, they will hog the lane and abuse you.

[blueoval]

Originally Posted by Ross 1

It's the love of the fast lane by people doing below the speed limit that will doom this to failure. Have driven in Germany and been a passenger in the UAE, if you aren't going fast enough the car behind simply flashes its lights and everyone politely moves over, sometimes even with a wave of acknowledgement. I just cannot imagine the average Sydney driving being able to take the blow to his or her ego and move over, they will hog the lane and abuse you.

This isn't restricted in Sydney. In SA we have the ego driven and territorial drivers here than have the entitlement factor etched into their crows feet riddled fore heads as they give you the finger while you try and calmly merge into the next lane. I mean, how dare anybody pull in front you them with their indicators on.

[XRtowcar]

Some countries in Europe have a 130kmh freeway limit reducing to 110kmh in poor conditions. Works a treat as the drivers are generally courteous and seem to know they have to move back into the outer lane after overtaking.
Won't work here as drivers aren't courteous and have no idea which lane they should be in.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by XRtowcar

Won't work here as drivers aren't courteous and have no idea which lane they should be in.

Some of the least courteous drivers on the planet are European, some use their horns more than their brakes. Its the high speeds that force courtesy. You increase speeds here the same thing will happen, look at the NT for proof.

[XRtowcar]

No. Just means there will be bigger accidents
Because of the higher closing speeds. They will still
sit in the fast lane of the Hume doing 95 in a 110 or 130 zone.
Only proper driver training and enforcement will change the driving culture.

[Sabantien]

Originally Posted by mtbkym01

Currently in Canada driving a Mustang around and what has blown me away is the "apparent disregard" to posted speed limits. I was doing 11kmh (101 in a 90) above the posted limit and a tour bus overtook me!!

On the dual lane Trans-Canada Hwy I've seen cars doing up to 130kmh (estimated) when the posted limit is 90. And it's very common too, not just a rogue one off driver either, it's lots of vehicles. Have seen a patrol car with a driver pulled over, he must've been doing an even greater speed.

It's seems to me that they consider the driving manner as much as just the speed

Found the same thing in the US. I drove from NY to DC, did the speed limit the whole way, sitting in the right lane (felt weird!), and cars were flying by. Even others using the slow lane were coming up behind me and zooming by.
Spoke to an american mate, he said speed limits were more suggestions, and so long as you keep up with the flow of traffic, you won't get done.

I spent the trip back in the fast lane. I think I was doing 150+ the whole way, and that was just keeping up with people, still had the odd person pass me.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Can you tell us how we identify this weak, disadvantaged, minority.

They're like vegans and crossfitters... they'll tell you

[noflac52]

It seems to be a common theme here that many drivers don't know what they are doing so raising the speed limits is unfeasible.

The answer is right there in front of us! Its so simple!

Make licencing a lot harder and teach the skills needed. The weak disadvantaged minority will be the ones who don't pass and they will be on public transport thus increasing the use of public transport to a level where it can be expanded greatly because there will always be a relatively stable percentage of the public who will be required to use it. The demand will always be there.

Those who pass the more difficult testing regime will be able to travel at realistic (increased) speeds to move efficiently from place to place in a safe manner, rather than the dogs breakfast that we have at the moment.

The benefits to the economy will be untold not to mention the improvement in air pollution in big cities.

The number of cars sold will decrease but we no longer have a vehicle manufacturing industry to support so that isn't a problem either and the manufacturing of public transport vehicles, railways etc will compensate for this anyway.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by noflac52

It seems to be a common theme here that many drivers don't know what they are doing so raising the speed limits is unfeasible.

The answer is right there in front of us! Its so simple!

Make licencing a lot harder and teach the skills needed. The weak disadvantaged minority will be the ones who don't pass and they will be on public transport thus increasing the use of public transport to a level where it can be expanded greatly because there will always be a relatively stable percentage of the public who will be required to use it. The demand will always be there.

Those who pass the more difficult testing regime will be able to travel at realistic (increased) speeds to move efficiently from place to place in a safe manner, rather than the dogs breakfast that we have at the moment.

The benefits to the economy will be untold not to mention the improvement in air pollution in big cities.

The number of cars sold will decrease but we no longer have a vehicle manufacturing industry to support so that isn't a problem either and the manufacturing of public transport vehicles, railways etc will compensate for this anyway.

Totally agreed, im all for more stringent testing and a greater focus on driver education beginning at School level.

This would be the first step before any consideration could be given to lifting speed limits.

Dont get me wrong, i'd love to see limits on good roads lifted, having driven Adelaide-melbourne-Adelaide in the last few weeks i found the 100k/hr stretch monotonous to say the least, it could easily have been 110 or more all the way.
Having said that, its only an 9 hr drive so your only really saving 35mins at best and the fuel consumption was greater at 110.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by noflac52

The number of cars sold will decrease but we no longer have a vehicle manufacturing industry to support so that isn't a problem either and the manufacturing of public transport vehicles, railways etc will compensate for this anyway.

Er, the public transport manufacturing sector is also heading overseas at a rate of knots.

All we'll be producing here eventually will be cappuccinos.

[burnz]

Originally Posted by XRtowcar

No. Just means there will be bigger accidents
Because of the higher closing speeds. They will still
sit in the fast lane of the Hume doing 95 in a 110 or 130 zone.
Only proper driver training and enforcement will change the driving culture.

such a pessimist, wont someone think of the children !

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by noflac52

It seems to be a common theme here that many drivers don't know what they are doing so raising the speed limits is unfeasible.

The answer is right there in front of us! Its so simple!

Make licencing a lot harder and teach the skills needed. The weak disadvantaged minority will be the ones who don't pass and they will be on public transport thus increasing the use of public transport to a level where it can be expanded greatly because there will always be a relatively stable percentage of the public who will be required to use it. The demand will always be there.

.

Bloody hell, more strict and harder? We already have the strictest licensing in the world.

In Germany you need between 10-20 hours of driving to get your license. In NSW its 120 hours before you can even start taking tests.

[aussie muscle]

No one has mentioned opportunity cost. for every minute you save on the road, is a minute you can spend at home (or work or at the game or the holiday). the lower speed limit looses you how much time over your life?

[noflac52]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Bloody hell, more strict and harder? We already have the strictest licensing in the world.

In Germany you need between 10-20 hours of driving to get your license. In NSW its 120 hours before you can even start taking tests.

In NSW its 120 hrs of basic driving only. To get a licence only! Its not a comprehensive skills test by any means. Or attitude assessment or intelligence assessment or aptitude test to see if you can actually handle a car at speed and make the necessary decisions required.

Don't tell me it worries you because you won't come up to the standard required?

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by aussie muscle

No one has mentioned opportunity cost. for every minute you save on the road, is a minute you can spend at home (or work or at the game or the holiday). the lower speed limit looses you how much time over your life?

I dont know about you or anyone else, but most long distance trips where an extra 10-20k/hr would make a significant difference, i prefer the journey over the destination to the point where i get there and cant wait to get back in the car and driving.

Im doing Adelaide-Canberra in late August when my Daughter will represent SA in the U18 National Bowls, if im honest, im more excited about the drive than the 4 days in the Nations capital. From there we head to the Gold Coast to spend 2 weeks with my Brother and family, again, its more about the drive, im in no hurry. The trip back to Adelaide, some 2200k's will see me in my element, why rush.

[burnz]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

I dont know about you or anyone else, but most long distance trips where an extra 10-20k/hr would make a significant difference, i prefer the journey over the destination to the point where i get there and cant wait to get back in the car and driving.

Im doing Adelaide-Canberra in late August when my Daughter will represent SA in the U18 National Bowls, if im honest, im more excited about the drive than the 4 days in the Nations capital. From there we head to the Gold Coast to spend 2 weeks with my Brother and family, again, its more about the drive, im in no hurry. The trip back to Adelaide, some 2200k's will see me in my element, why rush.

I understand, but you will get into a groove, and come across someone who is slower than you.
then annoy you, you will quickly overtake so you can get back to "your" groove.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by burnz

I understand, but you will get into a groove, and come across someone who is slower than you.
then annoy you, you will quickly overtake so you can get back to "your" groove.

Wouldnt that happen regardless of the posted limit, infact, if the posted limit was 130k/hr and i came up on someone who's happy to do the current 100/110k/hr, wouldnt i be even further infuriated by their lack of pace.

I would hazard a guess and say that outside the confines of a few automotive forums, most people are happy with the maximum speed limits, cant say i've ever heard it discussed outside of one.
With that in mind, slow objects in 130 zones would be continuous.

[blueoval]

This is where I think policing the 'keep left unless over taking' rule should be heavily looked at and fined for those impeding other road users. i think that is where most of the frustration lies.

[burnz]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Wouldnt that happen regardless of the posted limit, infact, if the posted limit was 130k/hr and i came up on someone who's happy to do the current 100/110k/hr, wouldnt i be even further infuriated by their lack of pace.

I would hazard a guess and say that outside the confines of a few automotive forums, most people are happy with the maximum speed limits, cant say i've ever heard it discussed outside of one.
With that in mind, slow objects in 130 zones would be continuous.

not much in away of duel lane roads to overtake coming from SA..

if you run into someone without cruise control, it can be annoying.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by blueoval

This is where I think policing the 'keep left unless over taking' rule should be heavily looked at and fined for those impeding other road users. i think that is where most of the frustration lies.

Along with mobile phone usage and tailgating...

But fear not, my missus got a $340 fine yesterday when she pulled up behind a row of traffic at a rail crossing and as my daughter needed to get on the train to get to work to earn her $30, she moved to the other side of the road to pass 1 car and turn in to the carpark, a distance of no more than 15 mtrs.

There was no danger as the oncoming traffic was stopped, but he wasnt interested, just wrote the ticket and wished her a nice day.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

I would hazard a guess and say that outside the confines of a few automotive forums, most people are happy with the maximum speed limits

When I do interstate drives, I see an awful lot of drivers doing >110

I also see the police enforcing limits on freeways more than anywhere else, suggesting a lot of drivers want to, and do go faster

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by burnz

I understand, but you will get into a groove, and come across someone who is slower than you.
then annoy you, you will quickly overtake so you can get back to "your" groove.

If people are concerned on here (and are projecting a little) with their lack of driving skill and are worried, they can always keep left but I suspect they have no problems at all especially if they have been driving for more than a year.

It is much more cognitively difficult to drive in traffic and city streets anyway.


We do have one advantage here with slow moving objects, most of the world's trucks are limited to 80 or 90 whereas our are 100

[cram_it_frog]

there are some sections of the Hwy between Broken Hill and Adelaide which are unsafe at the 110

it is fine to up the speed limit but the road need fixing especially in more remote area s

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by Brazen

We do have one advantage here with slow moving objects, most of the world's trucks are limited to 80 or 90 whereas our are 100

image

That's a disadvantage here, not an advantage. When you have the same speed limit you can't overtake heavy vehicles quickly and safely and get out of their way.

In Australia we have the dangerous situation of the "slow creep" overtake where the vehicles are in close proximity at high speed for far to long. Frustrating for heavy vehicle drivers too as they are probably driving in reality to the speed limit via GPS whereas the overtaking car is going by an over-reading speedo and afraid of being pinged by the paramilitary, er highway patrol, for being 1 km/h over when they are actually 5 km/h under. Perfect officially-sanctioned accident scenario.

[mechanic]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Along with mobile phone usage and tailgating...

But fear not, my missus got a $340 fine yesterday when she pulled up behind a row of traffic at a rail crossing and as my daughter needed to get on the train to get to work to earn her $30, she moved to the other side of the road to pass 1 car and turn in to the carpark, a distance of no more than 15 mtrs.

There was no danger as the oncoming traffic was stopped, but he wasnt interested, just wrote the ticket and wished her a nice day.

I'm about to go to Cairns in a moment from my home here at Edmonton, a distance of about 14 klms.
I'd be very surprised if I didn't see at least 6 or 8 people on their mobiles while driving between here and there.
Normally see the Captain Kodak van getting all those 1 klm over as well.

Politicians never take notice of those who do research, they listen to statisticians who can give them figures to add to next years budget.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Brazen

If people are concerned on here (and are projecting a little) with their lack of driving skill and are worried, they can always keep left but I suspect they have no problems at all especially if they have been driving for more than a year.

I think you've missed the point.
Im certainly not concerned with my own ability to travel above 110k/hr, im more concerned about the numpty who THINKS HE CAN drive above 110k/hr, BUT CAN'T, and will end up killing someone to prove it.

In an ideal world those who can, should, and those who cant, wont, but that is wishful thinking. If just one of those who shouldnt, does, they may just wipe your family out.
Would you still be an advocate.

Having said that, what makes me think i can, well me, and im perfect, which underlines my point.
Just because i think i can doesnt mean i actually can, it just means i may risk mine and your families lives to find out.
But hey, if the sign says 130, im up for it.

[Mowdit]

case in point to the last few posts.

My 23yo girlfriend (back in the day, OK, 20 years ago)

from regional vic, she would quite happily belt along at 100kph any day, BUT, come across a tractor traveling on the verge on a two way road and she wouldn't pass, she would sit there traveling at 16kph because she was too scared to overtake !!!!

WTF....................

Taught to pass the test

NOT taught to drive !!!!!!



Other side of the coin................
Got my motor cycle licence, in Tassie around 1994,
local copper "how did you get here"?
Me "rode here"...
Copper, "do a figure 8" (in a gravel car park)
Me, "fine"
IT STARTED RAINING, so back inside with a PASS
GOLD