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The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
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#31 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2005
Location: In my shed
Posts: 5,066
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As others have said mechanical condition of your car as well as driving to the conditions at the time plays a part in self preservation.
Also after periods of little rain and hot days, there is always a build up of contaminents on the road surface that rear their ugly head after a decent downpour, hence the roads look like they have froth on the surface after cars drive through puddles etc. |
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#32 | ||
Ford Convert
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Epping
Posts: 443
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Mate I'm a firm believer that traction control is rubbish in a situation like that..... absolute rubbish.
Counter steering and a little throttle control would have seen you back on track no worries. Thats providing you've got a limited slip diff. If you don't you need to be careful with the throttle as you can easily end up in a spin with a single spinner diff. I've always found NO THROTTLE till you straighten up then power on is the way to get out of it. Last thing you should do is jam the picks on. |
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#33 | |||
Browsing here and there..
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Posts: 2,075
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#34 | ||
Performance moderator
![]() Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: St Clair..N.S.W
Posts: 14,875
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Keep in mind there was an accident in an XR6 just around the corner from home last weekend..
http://mt-druitt-standard.whereilive...lyton-tragedy/ All three young men where killed.. There was no speed involved !!!Maybe too fast for conditions !!Life is NOT a PlayStation game !!! Modern cars handle so well that it's taken for granted!!! Then when it rains or similar road issues .. Accidents happen !!!!! If I was you I would go and buy yourself, friends and family a lottery ticket !!! You could EASY be in a very cold room right now !!! Give ya Mum & Dad a big hug !!!! Btw I know how things happen I have worked for emergency as line worker for the local elect authority.. Seen way too many accidents, dead people !!! YES tyres are stuffed and replace with good tyres.... Treat it as a fine to yourself...For not driving to the conditions...
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Real cars are not driven by front wheels,real cars lift them!!... BABYS ARE BOTTLE FED, REAL MEN GET BLOWN. Don't be afraid to try something new. Remember, amateurs built the Ark...Professionals built the Titanic! Dart 330ci block turbo black pearl EBXR8 482 rwkw.. Daily driver GTE FG.. Projects http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=107711 http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthr...8+turbo&page=4 Last edited by ebxr8240; 10-02-2010 at 09:39 PM. |
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#35 | ||
Moderator
![]() ![]() Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Foothills of the Macedon Ranges
Posts: 18,529
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I live in Sunbury and those roundabouts can get mighty slippery after even light rain. Vehicles turning deposit fuel, oil and other stuff on the surface.
As just_pazz said, going around these roundabouts when wet, you have to tread very carefully even if you have roadworthy tyres, be gentle on the throttle, sometimes you need to be very slow depending on the road incline etc. I've seen many cars come to grief right in front of me, I even predict that it will happen by the speed they are doing, and the trajectory they will take when grip is lost. The more you drive, the more experience you get to prevent sliding, thats another silly omission in the licence tests. BTW, my raingauge read exactly 50mm when I got home this afternoon. Also BTW, while I'm typing this, I can hear the V8's revving on the wet roads in the next estate as they usually do after some rain. |
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#36 | ||
dipstick
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: sutherland shire
Posts: 478
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give the bloke a break.i bet hes not the first bloke to lose a rear drive falcon in the wet.
do yourself a favour and get some decent tyres.good grip in the wet could be the difference between a little lose and a bad crash. When i drive my ba i turn the traction control off. but i dont think it would make the car flick the other way.it cuts power to the wheels. once there is heaps of water on the road you can aquaplain and thats nasty for any driver my two cents. |
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#37 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,412
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Quote:
Secondly to the part of your post that I have highlighted. This is a perfect example as to why there should be compulsory advance driving course for people to get their licence. If you had done one of these courses you would have learnt in a controlled environment what to do and not out on the road where there was the chance of you hitting another car and injurying yourself and other people. Always remember accidents don't just happen, people cause them |
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#38 | ||
Steve
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sth East Qld
Posts: 1,284
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My take is that the traction control was off and there was a bit of over correction with the boot still in to it.
Traction control is in your right foot. Anyway as long as it put the wind up you and you avoid it again and get some professional instruction.
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Currently no Fords . 2005 Statesman International 5.7, Mazda 2 and a Hilux. Former Fords: 2010 Ford Escape 2007 BF11 GT, TE50 Series 1 ,AU V8 One Tonner ,EL Falcon Wagon, ED Fairmont , EB Falcon Series 1. Mk 2 Cortina Company Fords : 3 BA Falcons , EB 11 Falcon Wagon , Ford F350 351 V8. |
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#39 | ||||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,602
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Quote:
When it has been hot dry and then it rains, extra care is needed as all the dirt and oil that has built up on the road - add water and it becomes a bit too slick. There's usually more grip in the wet when there is regular rain. Plus there's coolant drips as cars swelter in the heat and cooling systems are pushed towards the limit. Coolant = oily = slippery when added to wet roads.
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#40 | ||||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,602
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Quote:
Traction control and Electronic Stability Control aren't magic cure alls. They won't stop all "losses of control". The laws of physics still apply.
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#41 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 601
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Firstly, traction control kills the power. I have no idea how it spun you around.
Secondly, the tyres let you down, why would you want to fix them??? There is a lot more to tyres than just tread depth. Tyres do deteriorate with age. The rubber dries and goes hard reducing the grip available. Been lots of stories recently abouit tyre shops selling old (age) tyres that are new, but have a limited life. Maybe do a search here for "tyre dating" or similar. That, plus a couple of driving courses, should help. (Don't do it on the road, You should already know why). Also, when you do buy new tyres, don't go cheap. They are the only things keeping you on the road. |
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#42 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 18,985
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#43 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Sydney
Posts: 128
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#44 | ||
Ford Convert
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Epping
Posts: 443
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Yeah I'm serious.
Sounds like you need a lesson in how to drive a car mate. Last edited by just_pazz; 10-02-2010 at 11:39 PM. |
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#45 | ||
I ♥ EDM
![]() Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,141
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Unless the OP has taken this roundabout with some enthusiasm, then this wouldnt have happened. Ive taken plenty of roundabouts in my dead scary ol' live axl'd EL GLi with no traction issues (and im sure plenty of members here have done the same in much older falcons). Simply a matter of driving to the conditions, if you don't, well this sort of thing is bound to happen.
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#46 | ||
FG XR6T trayback
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: N-W NSW
Posts: 1,308
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Playstation has a lot to answer, for some of the driving skills of the new breed of drivers. My 5 cents worth.
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#47 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 18,985
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#48 | |||
Ford Convert
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Epping
Posts: 443
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Quote:
Secondly if your unable to countersteer and apply throttle, or no throttle in a single spinner's case at the right time then perhaps a rear wheel drive vehicle is not a good idea. |
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#49 | |||
MIGHTY MAGPIES 2010
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: yarram se vic in the shed listening to pinkfloyd and rubbing panels
Posts: 3,081
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#50 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ballarat
Posts: 2,122
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Yep it was definately over correction or he was already in a 4 wheel slide. Cant see how traction control would have snapped it the other way. Take it as a lesson learned mate, I done something similar when I was on my p's and it was a huge eye opener. As has been said, gotta drive to the conditions and get to know the car if you want to be enthusiastic. Remember though that if there was another car or pedestrian there at that moment what could have happened. Use this as motivation before you go tokyo drifting in built up areas.
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#51 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ballarat
Posts: 2,122
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#52 | ||
Browsing here and there..
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Posts: 2,075
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I was expecting some heat in this thread ofcourse but please understand that what happened today was not intentional at all. I have no reason to make this thread and lie about it.
just_pazz you're right, i'm not the best driver in the world as i've had my P plates for maybe 6 months or so. I do have alot to learn about the road, but that'll come in time. I took a closer look at the car tonight and it looks like there is no damage to the rim at all (apart from some very minor gutter rash) and it's just the tyre. I also took a look in my boot and located my car jack, but do BA XR6s come with a wench or so to remove the lug nuts? I plan to change it over with the spare tomorrow morning if I can. I guess while we're on the topic, can anyone recommend some good tyres as i'll be changing both rears at the same time. |
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#53 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ballarat
Posts: 2,122
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Get the widest profile you can, I remember my Nexen R3000's being great in the wet. Pretty sure they were 275 width and cost a crapload though.
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#54 | |||
Steve
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sth East Qld
Posts: 1,284
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Quote:
As you can see from my avatar I drive a GT , a bit more power than the OP XR6 . If I boot it on a slippery roundabout traction control will allow a small slide/wheel spin, then kick in ,and you can floor it but it will just miss and fart,it will not spit me the other direction .My point is that I think our mate was having a bit of fun in the wet and lost it .Unfortunate for him but a lesson is learned. Your example at 30km/h does not gel with me , what about the understeer first,if it was that slippery surely there was no front end grip first. I have done three advanced driving courses and on every occasion experienced understeer befor losing the rear end on a skid pan.. The cars were a AU v8 one tonner, The GT .The only car I lost rear grip in was in a race prepped Honda Integra at Oran Park on the Hairpin at the the end of the straight and got the Apex wrong , it slid the rears and I tried to catch it and it gripped then spat the other away mainly because at that point I should have accelerated being front wheel drive it may have pulled me out of the spin..I then had all brakes locked up . A bit different from old mate on a wet roundabout,I was on slicks doing about 90 km/h in the dry. But look at the end of the day its only a opinion ,at that what makes these forums interesting.
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Currently no Fords . 2005 Statesman International 5.7, Mazda 2 and a Hilux. Former Fords: 2010 Ford Escape 2007 BF11 GT, TE50 Series 1 ,AU V8 One Tonner ,EL Falcon Wagon, ED Fairmont , EB Falcon Series 1. Mk 2 Cortina Company Fords : 3 BA Falcons , EB 11 Falcon Wagon , Ford F350 351 V8. |
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#55 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 18,985
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#56 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,112
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Quote:
Its difficult to give an inexperienced driver advice on what to do when surprise oversteer is encountered. Instincts kick in, and unless you know what your doing chances are those instincts will get you in even more trouble. I was lucky enough to get some good driving training in when i was younger, 20ish I think, when a few mates and I bought a MKII Cortina for a slab of beer, and rallied it around dirt tracks on a private paddock out back of Geelong. Priceless experience that was! Although that came after I spun my XD a handfull of times on the road in circumstances very similar to those described by the OP. I guess the only difference to me and a lot of young drivers today after 6 months on our P's, is that I was getting around in a clapped out 302 XD, not a modern 200kw Falcon.... |
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#57 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 601
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Why people are doubting you.
My wife in our XR8 at skidpan. Doing about 60-70 k's, in 2nd. ![]() Me in our in our XR8, same skidpan, same day, same speeds, just in 1st gear, different accelerator action. ![]() ![]() Can you see a difference? Yes I clipped the cones. Safer on a skidpan thean on a street. Do a driver training course or two. It will help a great deal. I think some of us may have forgotten when we first start out driving, that when things go pear shaped, it all happens too quickly. Maybe that was what happened here and he missed the mistakes he made. Luckil it happened at low speed and no one was hurt. |
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#58 | ||
FPRJET
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,143
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I thought the ba xr6 didn`t have traction control. i thought it had to be a turbo or xr8 to have traction control.
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#59 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,566
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My dad gave me the best advice
he said to me "if you lose it from giving it too much don't be a hero and try to steer out of it and power on, hit the brakes and correct yourself no matter how much you think you wimped out and look silly i guarantee you'd be a hell of a lot more embarassed if you wrote off your car". ABS and quick reactions have kept me out of trouble. I know I can correct myself but why risk it? There's a difference between a controlled skid and one you do that snuck up on you because you were careless to the OP; you're lucky to experience this. As others have said it's an eye opener and just coming off my first year of p plates as long as you understand where you went wrong a near accident will make you a more aware and more careful driver
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Current Blueprint 03 xr8 ![]() 5 speed manual, Difilippo Quad Big Boy system, BPR CAI, BPR Custom tune, Underdrives 256rwkw ![]() ![]() BA manual Typhoon Fully optioned, 340rwkw@16psi (thanks Bluepower)! The old ride.... AU Fairmont, cammed beast, R.I.P you made my p plate years bearable! 150.8rwkw courtesy BPR |
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#60 | ||
Just slidin'
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Brisvegas
Posts: 7,791
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Unfortunately Stattic, once your gone, brakes dont help much. Best thing to do, off the loud pedal, let it straighten up. Takes a lot of practice to not jump on the brakes, but after a few skidpans, you get used to it. Jumping on the brakes just makes things 10 times worse.
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