The empire strikes back (another hypothetical)

[vanman_75]

gt for the badge ,sprint didnt and wont really do anything for me ...........gee you been thinking a lot flappist

[Romulus]

FG XR8 Sprint. The FG GT 315 engine is a pig for supercharging, the 290 on the other hand is great.

[Whitey-AMG]

Sprint for me as well............

The FG....XR8 looks better and if it performed admirably and was 10K cheaper...I'd be happy. The current GT in FG guise is a bit of a TROLL........wasn't a fan of it looks from the beginning and it still hasn't grown on me........I'm trying real hard..but losing the battle.........roll on FG2 with some better thought out and cohesive styling......

If the question / situation was for BF...........no brainer........GT all the way.

Whilst you're at it Flappy...why not bring back the ESP as well !!!!!!.........add a EURO touch to the local product........or is that the GTE anyways.....??

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Donny

Easy one for me. Irrespective of cost.

GT = History, tradition, pedigree, looks, prescence etc.
Sprint = Nothing.

The XR may be a little better looking on the outside over the current GT, but when you open up the XR cabin and look inside the trim levels are complete and absolute : .

Unless you option in leather which helps, but theres still those feral cheap looking cluster guages and that non colour ICC without splashing out for more options and cost.

The Sprint to me in a hypothetical FG line up would EXACTLY equal a poor mans GT. Like the GS was unkindly referred to in the 70's

Was easier to stick Donny's quote in as it was what I was going to say ..... Except the GT murders the XR in looks on the outside ....

Ford would still have this as the V8 performance model .... no matter what they did to the Sprint. The Sprint was a one hit wonder ... as good as they were, like the TE/S AU's were not GT ....... even if it was only missing the badge. If FPV put more effort into the GT, it will guarantee it will remain as the icon it is/was but I still love what they have done so far. GT for me



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[flappist]

Originally Posted by ESP

Whilst you're at it Flappy...why not bring back the ESP as well !!!!!!.........add a EURO touch to the local product........or is that the GTE anyways.....??

Actually I had never thought of that. The GT-E and ESP do seem to share quite a bit of DNA.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by flappist

Actually I had never thought of that. The GT-E and ESP do seem to share quite a bit of DNA.

I wonder how it would sell if it was called an ESP rather the GT-E??

[LowEL2XR8]

To buy a car and pay extra for a badge to me seems ridiculous. I'd take the Sprint.
I wouldn't buy either car for collecting purposes either I'd buy it and drive it.

All the little interior luxuries the GT has over the sprint are lost on me as well. So no body kit and lower class interior suit me perfectly.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by LowEL2XR8

To buy a car and pay extra for a badge to me seems ridiculous. I'd take the Sprint.
I wouldn't buy either car for collecting purposes either I'd buy it and drive it.

All the little interior luxuries the GT has over the sprint are lost on me as well. So no body kit and lower class interior suit me perfectly.

People buy Merc's, BM;s and countless others ...... not because of how good they are but because of the badge and in many many cases, pay dearly to do so. Nothing wrong with it at all. To own a Rolex when a Casio does exactly the same thing?



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[Airmon]

Assuming they depreciate evenly (very hypothetical), then definitely the Sprint. Depends on whether you buy it because you want a sports car or a Grand tourer.

Holden did a similar thing with the SV8, they didn't sell as well but I'd go an SV8 over an SS any day. Same car, just cheaper with a different body kit and interior.

[LowEL2XR8]

Originally Posted by auslandau

People buy Merc's, BM;s and countless others ...... not because of how good they are but because of the badge and in many many cases, pay dearly to do so. Nothing wrong with it at all. To own a Rolex when a Casio does exactly the same thing?

Nah nothing wrong with it. Each to their own. I was just expressing my opinion on the Sprint V GT.

On a side note I'd take the Casio with my Sprint too.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

I wonder how it would sell if it was called an ESP rather the GT-E??

As well as if it were called a Force 8? I hope not. I suspect the GT part of GT-E has helped a bit. I also suspect that FPV will not ever release a another V8 without GT in the title somewhere as regardless of how good they are, all of the T series and the Force 8 sold only a fraction of the sales of GT(X).

It is quite complex, the poll shows strong support for the "Sprint".

In theory, theory and reality are the same but in reality they seldom are......

[Sprint_ED]

i think it really depends on the type of car owner you are, some pefer to stand out, some are after speed and etc. etc

i had a choice of an xr8, sprint and a gt, at the time i felt that the XR6 was a better car than the XR8, and i knew that the GT had more style and looks, but the Sprint was more subtle, didnt stand out, and yet had the same power.

later on i did realise that the sprint was actually quicker due to not having all the gizmos inside, such as the ghia interior, and all the bodywork

to me i feel that in the current state, that ford is in the same stance, IMO the FG xr6 turbo is alot better than the XR8 ( and possibly all FG V8's), and alot of people who want performance would pefer a F6 over a GT, but there is also some people that want only a v8, but dont care about the bigger bodykits and to 'stand out' so in this sense, the sprint would be a good choice,

and then again, my main choice to buy mine in the end was to have a car that every man and his dog didnt have, this is in the same category now, with thousands of xr8's around and hundreds of GT's bing sold, having a sprint would make it rarer and more sought after in the years to come

[GTpilot]

Originally Posted by flappist

I was talking recently with some ford enthusiests I know who are not members here about the F6E and the comment was made that FPV only released it because they saw how well the G6ET was selling.
This led to Ford vs FPV discussions on many fronts and the question "What if ford released an XR8 Sprint again like they did in the ED would it take GT sales?

Ford didn't release the XR8 Sprint. Tickford (Now FPV) did.
Ford did not produce any XR's straight out of the factory until FPV took over tickford and started producing the B series GTs.
Ford/FPV really needed to align themselves and their products with the Holden/HSV range in the market place.

As for XR8 Sprint, I ask "why?" FPV is put in place for a reason, after all it IS an acronym for Ford PERFORMANCE Vehicles.
The G6ET is really only there to make up for a lack of V8 Fairmont ghia so FORD can compete with the V8 calais. the XR series is there to compete with the SS and SSv all of them Factory produced with a factory badge.

[Airmon]

Originally Posted by flappist

It is quite complex, the poll shows strong support for the "Sprint".

In theory, theory and reality are the same but in reality they seldom are......

Unfortunately, a strong support for a cheaper GT on a Ford forums, where the majority of members aren't new car buyers isn't the greatest market research.
I'm sure the majority would love a V10 powered Falcon coupe, but we're a tad biased.

[jatt]

Personally still think the G6ET is the best looking car in the whole range (with the performance to boot) and wouldn't go past it.

[OzJavelin]

The Sprint would not be a "poor man's or entry level GT", it would not have the body kit, interior or upgrade options of the FPV range.

Unfortunately I think the time has come and gone for this type of car; I think it would fail. Look at the SV8 - basically SS without the fluff. Very much unloved. People want fluff these days .. they want the badges, heated seats, etc.

Personally I'd buy a Sprint (like I bought and SV8), but I fear I'd be in a small minority ..

[DJR-351]

Originally Posted by Airmon

Unfortunately, a strong support for a cheaper GT on a Ford forums, where the majority of members aren't new car buyers isn't the greatest market research.
I'm sure the majority would love a V10 powered Falcon coupe, but we're a tad biased.

Price has absolutely nothing to do with my vote for the Sprint....

[Whitey-AMG]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

I wonder how it would sell if it was called an ESP rather the GT-E??

I know its off TOPIC.but what the hell......

A current day ESP ( GTE ) should have had the following ( based on the buyer demographic / target audience )

• Delete Brembo Brakes ( save $$$$ )
• Add PBR type performance brake pack -( BREMBO option )
• LED Headlamp and tail light assembly
• Nappa leather interior ( sport / comfort seat design )
• MRC suspension set up
• 20 - 21" wheel and tyre package
• UNIQUE Classy 2 tone type paint package with limited colour combo
• Factory Quad exhaust outlets with OVAL TIPS ( ala AMG )
• FPV delete badge - ESP badging on front grille and rear bootlid ONLY
• CHOICE of T6 OR 8
• A night out on the town with the V8 Supercars Grid girls ( instead of FPV drive day ).......after all....the ESP would be the gentlemans car and not the BOY racer's car.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by ESP

I know its off TOPIC.but what the hell......

A current day ESP ( GTE ) should have had the following ( based on the buyer demographic / target audience )

• Delete Brembo Brakes ( save $$$$ )
• Add PBR type performance brake pack -( BREMBO option )
• LED Headlamp and tail light assembly
• Nappa leather interior ( sport / comfort seat design )
• MRC suspension set up
• 20 - 21" wheel and tyre package
• UNIQUE Classy 2 tone type paint package with limited colour combo
• Factory Quad exhaust outlets with OVAL TIPS ( ala AMG )
• FPV delete badge - ESP badging on front grille and rear bootlid ONLY
• CHOICE of T6 OR 8
• A night out on the town with the V8 Supercars Grid girls ( instead of FPV drive day ).......after all....the ESP would be the gentlemans car and not the BOY racer's car.

Like it all! except the 2 tone paint err i mean "coach work"..... ewww...

Unfortunately the ESP branding will result in "force 6/8" style sales.. at-least the "GT" branding will improve that to some degree..

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by SLWXR6

Gt for me. That namesake means more than "Sprint" IMO.

Sprint has history, its another sporty ford nameplate, first used in 63 on V8 models, it added things like sports seats wheels and more crome...

[Falc'man]

Ford recently had an ESP badge during the BF runout... silly thing to do.

FPV didn't undercut Ford when introducing the F6-E so I'm not sure this would affect G6ET's sales like it would FPV's if Ford "retaliate" with said package.

To answer the question, I'd take the GT, although the Sprint's understated guise would certainly get me thinking. The reason I say GT is due to it's road presence, which no pic can do justice. Awesome looking imo.

[Boss 330]

if it was still BA/BF, i would definately go with the sprint,the XRs looked nicer than the GTs but now with FG,i would go the FPV, i reckon the GT looks a million times better than the XR.

[Bossxr8]

I'd take the XR8 sprint if it was a series 2 with the grunt motor, mostly because my discount for Ford products is 21%, but only 14% on FPV's, so it would come in a hell of a lot cheaper. I wouldn't care if it was solely an engine upgrade to FPV power levels and nothing else, because the suspension and brakes can be done fairly cheaply later, and with better stuff than the factory offers.

[Envi XR8]

The thing this is, on these criteria, I think the Sprint would be closer the the GT of old, basic options, no trinkets or 5hit'n'glitter, an engine with extra grunt, more of the old school thought of a powerful engine/drive-line combo and marketed as a genuine factory styled hottie, where now-a-days, the new GTs are more like the Landaus and LTDs, with all their creature comforts and gizmos. XR8s are aimed at people who want a V8, something different and stands out of the crowd, but wants to move a family, or have a link to their enthusiast side by not driving an XT. The XR6Ts are aimed squarely at Driver's car market, and rightly so.

Besides, I have seen threads on here where people discredit the new GTs and such for having no racing heritage blah blah blah, and deem them to be nothing more than a stricker package. In light of all this, I'd take the Sprint.

my 2c worth

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Envi XR8

The thing this is, on these criteria, I think the Sprint would be closer the the GT of old, basic options, no trinkets or 5hit'n'glitter, an engine with extra grunt, more of the old school thought of a powerful engine/drive-line combo and marketed as a genuine factory styled hottie, where now-a-days, the new GTs are more like the Landaus and LTDs, with all their creature comforts and gizmos. XR8s are aimed at people who want a V8, something different and stands out of the crowd, but wants to move a family, or have a link to their enthusiast side by not driving an XT. The XR6Ts are aimed squarely at Driver's car market, and rightly so.

Besides, I have seen threads on here where people discredit the new GTs and such for having no racing heritage blah blah blah, and deem them to be nothing more than a stricker package. In light of all this, I'd take the Sprint.

my 2c worth

The GT's of old were based on the top of the Falcon range Fairmont, they weren't stripped out base models.

[Envi XR8]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

The GT's of old were based on the top of the Falcon range Fairmont, they weren't stripped out base models.

At no time did I suggest they were stripped out base models. My comment was that the older GTs had the basic options, I did not refer to them as optioned base models. True they were not stripped base models, but my point was that any car made to meet homologation (spelling) rules was certainly built for the purpose of racing, and was a rawer version, with the drivers not afforded much in the way of creature comforts. The criteria of this question, to me anyway, would put this concept of a new "Sprint" closer in DNA and design to the old GTs, that the new ones. Just my opinion.

I take it you are referring to the old GTs carrying the fairmont trim? Cause if that's the only point of your disagreement, am I fairly close to the mark with the rest of my post?

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Envi XR8

........... XR8s are aimed at people who want a V8, something different and stands out of the crowd, but wants to move a family, or have a link to their enthusiast side by not driving an XT............

And the FG GT is targeted at .... ? Do the numbers 290 & 315 have any bearing on what someone would buy, let alone the tougher (for me) looks than an XR8? Something different and stands out?? :yeees: Apart from a bulge I think they look a tad like an XR6 ..... but that could be just me? I still beleive the tag 'FORD GT' stands for something.

Hypothetically ..... if a Sprint was released I would guarantee that engine / drivetrain / brakeing would not and could not be specced close to GT. That's suicide and is about as likely as the V10 Twin tubro HO.



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[4Vman]

Any "sprint" derivative that Ford would release would be sticker and (maybe) suspension only... there's no way the powers would allow ford to cannibalise FPV's sales with power and performance upgrades over the std range...
The XR series is an entry level performance range for the budget conscious and will remain that way.

[Envi XR8]

You raise some good points.

Originally Posted by auslandau

And the FG GT is targeted at .... ? Do the numbers 290 & 315 have any bearing on what someone would buy, let alone the tougher (for me) looks than an XR8?

IMO the FG GT is aimed at a buyer demographic similiar the XR8, but the big difference being buyers are those who have the cash at their disposal, and the willingness to spend the extra on the top level model. I don't think anyone interested in the XR/FPVranges, would buy a base model falcon in place of an XR8 or GT. They would be more likely to buy a base type model 'brand whatever' as well as the GT to keep a weekly 400 kays off it.

Originally Posted by auslandau

Something different and stands out?? :yeees: Apart from a bulge I think they look a tad like an XR6 ..... but that could be just me? I still beleive the tag 'FORD GT' stands for something.

ok, but on that logic, be sure that you don't tell all the GT owners that their cars look like F6s. :yeees: indeed! My point was that the XR range stands out from the standard base model Falcon, and so attracts a more enthusiast-type buyer. Is that a fair statement? Let me put it to you like this then, YOU are walking through a Ford dealership, there are 2 cars parked side by side. Would you drawn to the white FG with the Factory hupcaps, or the a brightly coloured XR6 with the 18"s and body kit?

Originally Posted by auslandau

Hypothetically ..... if a Sprint was released I would guarantee that engine / drivetrain / brakeing would not and could not be specced close to GT. That's suicide and is about as likely as the V10 Twin tubro HO.

ummm... the question was hypothetical in any case, and yes if Ford did release a Sprint with the GT driveline it would be suicide in regard to sales of the GT range. Ford could not expect FPV to survive, if this type of car was released, but I think if it did, it would sell well. I know I'd have one.

[4Vman]

The GT "Brand" is THE most recognised and most powerful "brand" in the "Australian built" performance segment... Bar None.
People buy GT's for a whole host in intengiable emotive reasons.