National parks in the NT.... Say goodbye.

[xfalconz]

No worries, i dont experience what you have mentioned in your posts about the aboriginies etc and the problems they have/cause so maybe i was a bit harsh but its easy to have an us and them mentality without finding solutions anyway hopefully the government can get this problem sorted. I agree these areas should be avaliable for everyone to enjoy..

[kempster1]

A few people on this site need to go for a late night stroll down the Todd river on a dole day.
You may come out alive, but you will more than likely be bashed, have your wallet stolen, your shoes stolen, and you may keep your clothes.
This has got nothing to do with with land or social back ground.
It is just a group of poeple that is out of control, this group is getting larger by the day and is government funded.

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by kempster1

A few people on this site need to go for a late night stroll down the Todd river on a dole day.
You may come out alive, but you will more than likely be bashed, have your wallet stolen, your shoes stolen, and you may keep your clothes.
This has got nothing to do with with land or social back ground.
It is just a group of poeple that is out of control, this group is getting larger by the day and is government funded.

And the problem will soon be much worse... Clare is also cutting funding to the remote communities. We in the Alice can expect 5 to 7 thosand more, un educated, un employable, people that, bacically have no where to live to camp in the river. Great.

But that is totally differnt issue to the parks hand over. I will not comment more on that issue because, that is really going to wind some folk up.

[xfalconz]

Yeah i see your point tho my first reply was gonna be 'what do you suggest shoot them?' thats how some of your opinions of aboriginies came across.
There is no doubt alot of aborigainals are ИИИИed off about the history etc and our culture doesnt suit them and i agree with you this forms there attitude of behaving like they do.Anyway
To be fair with the way crime is in some parts of Sydney i would give a late night stroll a miss in both places..
Again like you say it all comes down to the goverments inability to deal with this problem.

[mik]

i went on a working holiday some years ago and i have some disturbing pictures etched in my mind, seeing some aboriganals in a brawl outside a of a dss branch in Kalgoorlie , walking the to the shopping centre of geraldton and meeting a group of aboriginals quizing me if i had some smokes, and why not??, im think ok time for me to get a beating here, but it didn`t happen, and i did see quite a few busy drinking themself into oblivion on my trip ,very sad, i was surprised to hear that some friends went to the rock but were not allowed to climb it as i did years ago, as outbackjack said due to religouse reasons, its a pity aussies in a high percentage are ignorant ,probably due to our pollies wrapping up issues with red tape gobbly gook and bullИИИИ.

[NAK302]

sounds like kempster1 and i have had a similar child hood. i completey understand where the original poster is coming from and unfortunetly emotion gets in the way of logic. unless you have lived in these areas of our fair country, where you need a permit just to swim at the local beach then you really have no idea what the original poster's point is. sad really because that would include about 99.9999% of the forum users.

[BJ]

Originally Posted by HOON69

well it was there land once upon a time
and now they are getting it back?


so whats everyone whinging about again

So when they come knocking on your door for your land, you will have no objections then i take it.
I use to work with theses people and what Outback Jack is saying is 100% correct. They get everything given to them and have no gratitude for it. All i can see coming out of all this is one b.l.o.o.d.y big pad lock.

[xfalconz]

Originally Posted by GT-0733

sounds like kempster1 and i have had a similar child hood. i completey understand where the original poster is coming from and unfortunetly emotion gets in the way of logic. unless you have lived in these areas of our fair country, where you need a permit just to swim at the local beach then you really have no idea what the original poster's point is. sad really because that would include about 99.9999% of the forum users.

Yeah point taken, like you say i havent lived there so i guess i missed the point.
Anyway ive caused enought trouble here thats it for me at this thread i think!!

[The Monty]

Kempster1 and outback jack. I share your ideals and arguments 100% Its sad to see what our country is becoming because of the government and some "uncontrolable" groups and minorities that share this country with us. Unfortunately to some people out there, this is deemed as a racist frame of mind, and I did not post here to be labelled a racist, just to show my disgust for the weakness of our government by letting minorities control them like puppets. My Uncle had a memorial park named after him after he was killed by a shark, but the land on which the park was named was re-claimed by Aboriginals and turned into what I will call a "drinking park". Its sad but true people, our country is falling apart at the seems.

[Tote]

The whole problem with this thread is that the word aboriginal has been used. If you use outback's statements and substitute "dole bludgers from Campbelltown" no one would object to any of the statements that were made and many would agree wholeherartedly. I've seen a lot of venom directed at car thieves and bad neighbours on this forum in threads that were not considered politically sensitive.
The only way to fix the problems described above is to give people a sense of self worth, an education, and employment. How you do this is a very large problem and "sit down money " isn't part of it.
It's not a racial problem, it's a behavioural one and in my experience a blackfella who's prepared to have a go will always be given a chance, even if he falls off the wagon a few times.
Those who feel that giving people charity will encourage them to bulld a better life should go for a drive and visit towns like Walgett, Bourke, Brewarrina or Wilcannia and see for themselves the shops with bars and roller shutters, pubs with no glass in the windows, just mesh and houses completely destroyed within months of being built.
Mabo is a good thing and goes towards addressing the injustices done in the past but the implementation of the high court decision is certainly influenced by the latte sipping ****ers in the capital cities.
Regards,
Tote

[svo347]

Have you actually read this Outback?? or did you just skim it and highlighted the key points concerned to you ????
http://www.nt.gov.au/dcm/parks/parks/index.shtml

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by svo347

Have you actually read this Outback?? or did you just skim it and highlighted the key points concerned to you ????
http://www.nt.gov.au/dcm/parks/parks/index.shtml

I read it, it is cotton wool wraped crap. If you read some of the journalsts comments and especially Richard Limm's "other side of the fence" take on things, you may have doubts as well. Maybe its my Irish blood. But I NEVER trust a servant of the crown. None of us should. The tuth is somewhere in the centre......

[Work Horse]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

As I said earlier on in my posting, I agreed that posting pictures was getting away from the FACT that more land is going the way of a few based on skin colour. The latte sipping do gooders in the main cities are part of the probem. And for you to say that Aboriginals are "victims" simply shows your lack of understanding of the situation here in the bush. We are all victims of our own actions.

But like I said canning the Indiginous folk does not make any difference to the fact that soon many of this countries jewels will be private property ie Ayres rock. Do you think that if this was not such an international icon that you would have acces to it?? It already has a poor reputation in the tourist industry as un reliable destination. People fly there from all corners of the globe simply to find that the rock is closed for "cultural reasons". It is regulary closed with no notice at all. This could be repeated all over the territory and perhaps Australia as whole. Sure, I am angry at the situation. But I am far more aware of the attitude of the soon to be recipients(SP?) of these parks.

Here is an example. How much do you reckon a block of land would cost in ASP? we are surounded by billions acres of land..... Guess what? You cant get a block of land out here. We are land locked by Aboriginal owned land. Its takes years of tippy toeing around their "beliefs" to get a few hectares of land for development. Thats the crux of the issue..... This country is not being shared equally with equality...... I bet if you came and lived out here for a month or two you would have a totally different outlook on the indiginous people. Every freind that has visited us out here came with big city sympathy, and left with a dose of outback reality.

Dont take anything that you read on that web site as being true. The truth of the matter is that Clare Matin is giving away "OUR" national parks as electoral pay back. Deals done in back rooms for Indiginous votes.

I guess the issue here with black people and land give aways go hand in hand. Many of these parks were established decades ago and have been jointly managed successfully ever since. When indiginous land groups get these parks given to them, do you think you will be welcomed with open arms or do you think that you will have to carry a wad of cash to get a welcome hug???

Peace, and a fair go to everyone.

Arrrrr.... not quite sure we are on the same page Outbackjack, and am becoming less interested as the thread goes on, but that's about me not you! You either didn't understand what I posted, have an agenda you wish to follow no matter what others say, or have pigonholed me with what you think I mean and gone off on a tangent based on that.

I don't buy into this whole bush Vs city divide, we are all in this together.

I was not a Jew during WW2, I was not an Australian solider captured by the Japanese, I have not lived under Stalin, Pol Pot or Saddam Hussein. I would bow to the knowledge of anyone who did live through these dark times. I know what happened was not right and should not have been allowed to go on for so long.

I have little experience living with the indigenous people of NT, I don't live there. I would bow to your, or anyone elses superior knowledge in that area. I do understand that there are very serious problems. I understand that the problems have been allowed to go on too long. And that we as fellow human beings have an obligation to do something about it. I am not blaming anyone for the plight of indigenous Australians.

Aboriginals are the "victims" of really poor health! I don't have to live in the bush to understand that. The fact that the reasons may be self inflicted mean little to the outcome for everyone involved. We have a "no-blame" health system, you can smoke yourself to death, drink drive, spend your whole life overweight and our health system still looks after you when things go wrong.

Your claims that everything the government says are lies, and everything you say is the truth will be up to individuals to work out for themselves. Your basic misunderstanding of why the decisions have been made should give people an idea.

I'm not calling anyone a racist but my Collins pocket dictionary says;"discriminatory, oppressive, abusive, or aggressive behaviour towards people because they belong to a different race. The belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with intrinsic superiority"

I experienced "racism" toward me as an Australian travelling overseas. At the time I thought is was funny and latter just plain stupid. Fancy anyone believing all Australian males were like the child molesters they caught in Thailand several years ago! Racism is just plain stupid.

As a side note, great Aussie film "The Castle" with Michael Caton. Anyone who's still a little miffed with the "Marbo" decision should get it on video. It's a great laugh also.

[Shonky]

Im a decendant of Jesus. Therefore the whole world is my sacred land.

I demand that I be given the entire world.

WHEN this occurs... I am going to lock you out unless you pay $1000 a head per day. If you dont pay you will have to leave the earth. As it is my sacred site...

[svo347]

Originally Posted by Young 'un

Im a decendant of Jesus. Therefore the whole world is my sacred land.

I demand that I be given the entire world.

WHEN this occurs... I am going to lock you out unless you pay $1000 a head per day. If you dont pay you will have to leave the earth. As it is my sacred site...

pull your head out of the proverbial.

[NAK302]

Originally Posted by Tote

Mabo is a good thing and goes towards addressing the injustices done in the past but the implementation of the high court decision is certainly influenced by the latte sipping ****ers in the capital cities.
Regards,
Tote

that sentence pretty much sums up the whole issue. discrimination falls on both sides.

[4.9 EF Futura]

*puts latte down and apologises for being born in a capital city as apparantley that had made me ignorant despite the fact that more than 95% of our population lives in capital cities*

Isnt it interesting how an issue like this really does bring everyone's prejudices to the table? I would like to echo the sentiments of workhorse - forget this 'city vs country' bulls**t. We in the city need rural Australia and rural Australia needs people in the cities.

Seriously, get off your high horse, cut the sh*t and get over it - we're all in it together.

I read it, it is cotton wool wraped crap. If you read some of the journalsts comments and especially Richard Limm's "other side of the fence" take on things, you may have doubts as well. Maybe its my Irish blood. But I NEVER trust a servant of the crown. None of us should. The tuth is somewhere in the centre......

Look, the NTgov has put the information up there - and you reject it as being false. Allow me to speculate - but I think that, no matter what they put on that page - you would have discredited it as more rubbish from those latte sipping ****ers in the city.

So instead of discussing a moot point, why not dicuss some better solutions?

You seem to have a better understanding of this matter than any politician, lawyer or high court judge. So - what should be done? If Mabo was overturned tomorrow and the entire nation looked towards you guys for the answer - what would it be???

[SunDrifter]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

I bet if you came and lived out here for a month or two you would have a totally different outlook on the indiginous people. Every freind that has visited us out here came with big city sympathy, and left with a dose of outback reality.

I deadset couldn't agree with you more Outback. And i'm sick people suggesting that comments like this is racist.

You know what's racist. When i go out on my lunch break and walk past an aboriginal group, only to be spat at and to hear "what are you f*&kin looking at ya white f*&k" simply because i refuse to look at my feet when walking past them. (hell, i wasn't even looking at them!)

Seriously, say, south of Mackay, chances are, you don't know the problems are.

You haven't seen them.

One of my previous jobs involved working on the computers and networks of the local council offices for Aboriginal and Islander communities. So i have met quite a few great, hard working Aboriginals (and islanders). But sadly, they are the true minority.

[merlin]

I just don't understand why everyone is not treated equally. By that I mean why are aboriginals given special treatment. If we are not allowed to be racist then why the special treatment for one group...i.e the giving of land.

My solution if I was King of Australia....Everyone is equal. Everyone has to work for their own money (no handouts). If anyone breaks the law they get arrested and sent to court for sentencing. Judges base sentences on everyone equally - fine or jail term (can't afford the fine go to jail). Jails not big enough? I'll build more. Problem solved.

[The Monty]

Originally Posted by merlin

I just don't understand why everyone is not treated equally. By that I mean why are aboriginals given special treatment. If we are not allowed to be racist then why the special treatment for one group...i.e the giving of land.

My solution if I was King of Australia....Everyone is equal. Everyone has to work for their own money (no handouts). If anyone breaks the law they get arrested and sent to court for sentencing. Judges base sentences on everyone equally - fine or jail term (can't afford the fine go to jail). Jails not big enough? I'll build more. Problem solved.

Touch'e.

[Laminge]

I still stand behind the Fact that this is a Ford Forum, and excluding my personal beliefs, take the discussion to a dedicated forum based on this content.

http://www.crossingboundaries.ca/forum.av/