What would you pay to be V8Supercar fast - Page 2

Des · 15-02-2006, 11:12 AM

Ok, Ok, enough foreplay!

:
If you don't love BDA's then there must be something wrong....
Make sure you keep us informed if you go ahead with this xbgs351.

Gammaboy · 15-02-2006, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xbgs351

FORD COSWOTH BDA

TOYOTA 4AGE

Look similar? That is because the twin cam 4AGE is basically a road going, mass produced version of the Ford Cosworth BDA twin cam racing engine. They share the same bore and stroke (81mm x 77mm), the same size valves (29.5mm & 25.5mm), and in some versions of the 4AGE very similar combustion chambers, port shapes & sizes. When fully prepared for racing, they both produce similar horsepower figures at similar revs.

Hence The 4AGE was selected as a replacement for the BDA in Formula Atlantic

Tiapan · 15-02-2006, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gammaboy

Hmmm... the latest v8 radical that holds the Nurburgring record? I'd sell my firstborn!

WHAT! did you say an aussie v8 supercar holds the nurburgring record?
if this is true..im lost for words...
better not be gettting my hopes up

xbgs351 · 15-02-2006, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiapan

WHAT! did you say an aussie v8 supercar holds the nurburgring record?
if this is true..im lost for words...
better not be gettting my hopes up

I think he means these cars:
www.radical.net.au

Gammaboy · 15-02-2006, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiapan

WHAT! did you say an aussie v8 supercar holds the nurburgring record?
if this is true..im lost for words...
better not be gettting my hopes up

No. God no. so far off the pace.
www.radicalmotorsports.com
they hold the record for the fastest road registered car around the ring in the SR8. not bad for only 360hp.

Rev28K · 15-02-2006, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xbgs351

Yes F2 or Formula Atlantic. Cars weigh in at little over 400kg. The BDA puts out around 210hp, so they also have a very high power to weight ratio. As for corner carving, the first time I saw one go through the esses at Winton, my jaw dropped. I have had a fascination with them since.

What times at Winton?

Either that or clubman class - live rear axle, 1.6 lite pushrod engine. Real clubmans not the IRS Toyota twin-cammed PRB/Caterham/Westfield.

I assume you have looked at ERA's (made by Tiger in the UK). They seem expensive for what you get (a replica old timer powered by a Zetec).

xbgs351 · 15-02-2006, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rev28K

What times at Winton?

Either that or clubman class - live rear axle, 1.6 lite pushrod engine. Real clubmans not the IRS Toyota twin-cammed PRB/Caterham/Westfield.

I assume you have looked at ERA's (made by Tiger in the UK). They seem expensive for what you get (a replica old timer powered by a Zetec).

At the 2005 Winton Historic Motor Racing festival there were a few Group Q and R cars lapping at 1 minute 21 seconds. That is 4 seconds a lap quicker than the V8Supercars were there in 2004, and about 30 seconds a lap quicker than my XB.

The guy that imports the ERA cars is a family friend. They are of no interest to me.

Rev28K · 15-02-2006, 05:14 PM

1:21!. Hmm quicker than I thought. I guess that there is no substitute for intelligent design and low weight.

I do 1:44 in my Honda (hopefully 1:43 or better soon) and will hopefully be the right side of 1:40 in my Datsun. The ERA is weird I was expecting it to be faster than it was. I was chatting to the old guy driving it and he said that under braking it was pretty good and he could go very deep under brakes in the esses. The next fun day up there hopefully we can get a couple of runs side by side and see how deep it goes (without me running over it). My 1100kg Honda seems to be able to brake a fair bit later than a 1500kg Nissan 350Z at that point (I’m not travelling as fast) so it will be interesting to see how deep the 450kg ERA can go.
http://www.tigerracing.com/cars/era-main.php

Any idea of what a Group C XD/XE Falcon, Group C L34/A9X Torana or Group C Commodore does on the long track?

xbgs351 · 16-02-2006, 06:26 PM

Well I decided to buy the car that I had my eye on as well as another $5000 worth of accessories. I was hoping to take delivery at the end of the month, however, I struck a major hitch. The owner decided that he no longer wanted to sell the car.

Here is a pictures of the car that I was looking at. It's an Elfin 630B.

RAREV8 · 16-02-2006, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Des

Atom Ariel I think their called.

Yep, Ariel Atom...best value high speed machine!

Rev28K · 16-02-2006, 07:35 PM

[QUOTE=xbgs351]It's an Elfin 630B.
QUOTE]

SWEEEET!!!

It is amazing what Elfin produced (Gary Cooper was "just" a panel beater).

Have you been to the Elfin factory and seen all of the old moulds (fairings, wheels, etc) and spare bits upstairs. They have a whole heap of old blueprints that they are gradually organising in to an organised system.

How are you for spares? Do you worry about the chassis/welds getting brittle with age?

Des · 16-02-2006, 08:02 PM

Great car! Pity he doesn't want to sell....

:

XRQTOR · 16-02-2006, 10:55 PM

v8 supercar fasteness, well my Ba will smoke a supercar in a straight line anyday.

But to beat it round a race track, a new Ford GT.

xbgs351 · 16-02-2006, 11:10 PM

Quote:

SWEEEET!!!

It is amazing what Elfin produced (Gary Cooper was "just" a panel beater).

Have you been to the Elfin factory and seen all of the old moulds (fairings, wheels, etc) and spare bits upstairs. They have a whole heap of old blueprints that they are gradually organising in to an organised system.

How are you for spares? Do you worry about the chassis/welds getting brittle with age?

Garrie Cooper produced some impressive cars including the MS7 and MR8. I spoke to Elfin and they said that they would have moulds and drawings for the car.

The car had been checked for cracks and one had been found in an upright, which was then repaired. Most of what bolts to the tub should be relatively easy to fabricate. Even the uprights shouldn't be that hard to cast.

Gammaboy · 16-02-2006, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

v8 supercar fasteness, well my Ba will smoke a supercar in a straight line anyday

Rightio.

xbgs351 · 16-02-2006, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

v8 supercar fasteness, well my Ba will smoke a supercar in a straight line anyday.

But to beat it round a race track, a new Ford GT.

You are pulling our legs aren't you?

XRQTOR · 17-02-2006, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gammaboy

Rightio.

Im not sure of the exaact time has run but it was a low 12 or high 11. A supercar isn't setup for straight line speed.

A current v8 supercar only has around 62o Hp.

Gammaboy · 17-02-2006, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

Im not sure of the exaact time has run but it was a low 12 or high 11. A supercar isn't setup for straight line speed.

A current v8 supercar only has around 62o Hp.

And they weigh 1300kg vs the 1800kg of the overweight pig Ford calls a BA.
Sorry sonny jim, i don't believe you.
Oh, AND the new GT wouldn't get near a v8 super on a track (And yes, i mean the mid engined thing).

Paris Hilton · 17-02-2006, 10:10 PM

Well, not as fast round the track as an open wheeler, but around the beaten track? ehehehe...

I want a full Group B prepared Peugeot 205 T16 Evolution II.

**Falcon Coupe** · 17-02-2006, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

v8 supercar fasteness, well my Ba will smoke a supercar in a straight line anyday.

But to beat it round a race track, a new Ford GT.

Post up your dyno graph and timeslip.

XRQTOR · 17-02-2006, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falcon Coupe

Post up your dyno graph and timeslip.

Don't have a timeslip with all the new mods yet.

If i make it back in time i'll be racing next wensday at WSIDW, will post up the new dyno sheet and time slip then. Peak power is all well and good but it's the torque that gets these things moving........

Steffo what are the specs and 1/4 mile times on a v8 supercar exactly. What power & tqe do they make.

XRQTOR · 18-02-2006, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gammaboy

And they weigh 1300kg vs the 1800kg of the overweight pig Ford calls a BA.
Sorry sonny jim, i don't believe you.
Oh, AND the new GT wouldn't get near a v8 super on a track (And yes, i mean the mid engined thing).

I would have thought a GT would have beaten a v8 supercar if they both had the same rubber under them.

Steffo · 18-02-2006, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

Steffo what are the specs and 1/4 mile times on a v8 supercar exactly. What power & tqe do they make.

Ok, well, let's use a car we know is good as an example...

Craig Lowndes' 888 Falcon...

640hp (478kW) @ 7500rpm
460ftlbs (623Nm) @ 5600rpm

Weight: 1355kg

Now, as they're set up for V8 Racing, with their suspension, control tyre etc, with the 3.5:1 diff (they also run 3.7, 3.25 and 3.15)

0-100km/h: 3.4 sec
1/4 Mile: 11.0 sec approx

Top Speed (with 3.15:1 diff): 300km/h (188mph) approx

However with their power/weight, if you gave them drag biased suspension, gearing like 4.11:1 or similar, and drag slicks, they'd probably do a low 9.

So I'm being asked for stats? Looks like my starts-whore reputation is doing fine...

:

But yeah, V8 SC's aren't the best drag cars in their proper circuit racing setup (obvious as to why...)

xbgs351 · 18-02-2006, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

Don't have a timeslip with all the new mods yet.

If i make it back in time i'll be racing next wensday at WSIDW, will post up the new dyno sheet and time slip then. Peak power is all well and good but it's the torque that gets these things moving........

Steffo what are the specs and 1/4 mile times on a v8 supercar exactly. What power & tqe do they make.

It's actually the area under the horsepower curve in the used rev range that is important. An engine with a high torque peak often has a flatter hp curve, and thus more area - but not all the time. All the talk of hp means top speed, torque means acceleration, or anything like that is often true: but the peak numbers are NOT the reason why.

V8Supercars are reported to have around 635 BHP & 455 ftlbs. 1/4 mile times are irrelevant for circuit racing.

XRQTOR · 18-02-2006, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steffo

Ok, well, let's use a car we know is good as an example...

Craig Lowndes' 888 Falcon...

640hp (478kW) @ 7500rpm
460ftlbs (623Nm) @ 5600rpm

Weight: 1355kg

Now, as they're set up for V8 Racing, with their suspension, control tyre etc, with the 3.5:1 diff (they also run 3.7, 3.25 and 3.15)

0-100km/h: 3.4 sec
1/4 Mile: 11.0 sec approx

Top Speed (with 3.15:1 diff): 300km/h (188mph) approx

However with their power/weight, if you gave them drag biased suspension, gearing like 4.11:1 or similar, and drag slicks, they'd probably do a low 9.

So I'm being asked for stats? Looks like my starts-whore reputation is doing fine...

:

But yeah, V8 SC's aren't the best drag cars in their proper circuit racing setup (obvious as to why...)

Thanks mate, always know who to ask for the hard info.

Hmmm 11 flat, thought they were slower than that. Would still love to line one up..........

XRQTOR · 18-02-2006, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xbgs351

It's actually the area under the horsepower curve in the used rev range that is important. An engine with a high torque peak often has a flatter hp curve, and thus more area - but not all the time. All the talk of hp means top speed, torque means acceleration, or anything like that is often true: but the peak numbers are NOT the reason why.

V8Supercars are reported to have around 635 BHP & 455 ftlbs. 1/4 mile times are irrelevant for circuit racing.

Ok so thats roughly 384rwkw, how does the torque relate to the wheels.

Yes i know but im talking in general and straight line acceleration here in general.

Gammaboy · 18-02-2006, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

I would have thought a GT would have beaten a v8 supercar if they both had the same rubber under them.

Downforce, power to weight and damper sophistication are all in the V8 supers advantage. so no.

xbgs351 · 18-02-2006, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

I would have thought a GT would have beaten a v8 supercar if they both had the same rubber under them.

At Winton, GT production cars such as the Ferraris that John Bowe drove were around six seconds slower than V8Supercars. Nations Cup cars were a couple of seconds slower than a V8Supercar.

XRQTOR · 18-02-2006, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xbgs351

At Winton, GT production cars such as the Ferraris that John Bowe drove were around six seconds slower than V8Supercars. Nations Cup cars were a couple of seconds slower than a V8Supercar.

WHat are the nations cup car's.

xbgs351 · 18-02-2006, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

WHat are the nations cup car's.

Ferraris, Lamborghini Diablo GTR, Chrysler Viper GTS, Porsche GT3 and that "Monaro" that did the Bathurst 24 hour.

A wild BA may have a hope against a V8Supercar in the quarter mile, but given a rolling start there would be no contest.