In a pickle..

WRP11 · 04-12-2006, 09:53 PM

Yesterday evening my 17 year old daughter, (whom is licensed, and completed a defensive driving course at Mt cotton,) was driving her boyfriends vl commodore north bound in the far left lane on the M1 near the hyperdome in Brisbane, it was absolutely belting down with rain and had been for about half an hour and the roads were pooled up and very deep and dangerous in alot of areas, yes, she lost control of the car and spun end for end, she clipped the left rear of another commodore wagon and ended up facing the wrong way down an on ramp, a witness says they were only doing about 70 because of the rain. The other driver pulled up quite a way up the road so my daughter got out and ran to see if they were ok, the driver of the other car lept out when he saw her aproaching his window, he launched at her, grabbed her by the collar with the intention to hurt her, the witness had pulled over and saw what was happening and sat on her horn which stopped him, the witness then told my daughter to get in her car and they proceeded to drive to the nearest police station. The police were fabulous, they bought her back to the scene and calmed this guy down (sort-of), by then I had arrived to rescue my baby, and I got the details of the other driver off the police, they wouldnt let me near him either because he wasn't approachable. Next thing an ambulance arrived, apparently that other driver had called it, he had some sort of injury all of a sudden... well, thats all very clear, my daughter screwed up, the police agree it could happen to anybody so I'm not being too hard on her, but now I have inherrited a serious bunch of bills, so, if it were you, what would you do? Because she is 17 and a full time student do you think his insurance company would do her anyway?, or would it automatically come to me? The boyfriend has no insurance, not even 3rd party.. she has insurance if shes driving HER car.
If the guy had been a bit more normal about the whole thing, re attacking her and injury which he absolutely didn't have prior to the ambulance arriving, I would be more forthcoming, I'd love to hear some comments on this, for and against....

regards
Jude

:

**Polyal** · 04-12-2006, 09:58 PM

Mate I would have cut sick at the other guy, what a knob.

Unfortunately, as a parent, I think you might have to pick up the tab. Are you sure her insurance only covers her car?

Sourbastard · 04-12-2006, 09:59 PM

Id get some legal advice, and I'd get it tomorrow morning.

Redrum · 04-12-2006, 10:04 PM

If the other party has insurance they will contact you in the future and probably hit you with the bills depending on the out come of the police investigation. If your daughter is determined to be at fault and liable then she will have to pay. But she can only pay what she is able to. I have heard of people only paying off $5.00 a week for damage over many years. But best thing to do for peace of mind is what sourbastard said, speak to a solicitor.

WRP11 · 04-12-2006, 10:06 PM

Im pretty sure it only covers her in her car, its in my name and she's a nominated driver of that car only..
I will get advice...
a point to add.... the police didn't file a report, they felt sorry for her, said it was just bad luck, so this guy would have trouble even prooving it happened?

Jude

Redrum · 04-12-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WRP11

Im pretty sure it only covers her in her car, its in my name and she's a nominated driver of that car only..
I will get advice...
a point to add.... the police didn't file a report, they felt sorry for her, said it was just bad luck, so this guy would have trouble even prooving it happened?

Jude

Sometimes police are unable to determine if anyone has committed an offence and thus do nothing other than submit accident reports. Then the issue of fault etc is played out in the civil arena. Did the other party have insurance?

XRated · 04-12-2006, 10:08 PM

There are some real bastards in this world. I hope your daughter is okay.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourbastard

Id get some legal advice, and I'd get it tomorrow morning.

Most lawyers are free for the first 30-60 minutes consoltation too. Get on it quick.

WRP11 · 04-12-2006, 10:10 PM

yes he has insurance, they already rang and said we would be getting a letter. I'm ok with the fact that she caused it, just screwed up that hereacted the way he did, I recon theres a road rage charge there, assault at the very least?

csv8 · 04-12-2006, 10:12 PM

Couldn't she lay charges under Queenslands road rage laws ??

WRP11 · 04-12-2006, 10:20 PM

I think I'll start by getting advise, wait for the letter then react, I have this guys phone number and it's taking all my strength to not ring him.

Yaw · 04-12-2006, 10:36 PM

It could go either way.

I doubt very much after all this is over her boyfriend will still be her boyfriend.
From a legal standpoint It can be argued that the boyfriend gave permission to drive the car, You mentioned she is licenced. It would usually come back to the owner of the vehicle. Since however he has no insurance he will probably try to pass the buck to her which is why I stated what I did above.

The road rage thing is after the event and another matter entirly. If she was to press charges she would be quite able to with a witness.
Try to keep the 2 incidnets separate in your head.

Back to the actual accident best thing you can do is wait for a letter of demand either from the guys insurance comapny or himelf. I am looking at this from an insurance company recovery point of veiw.

The guy should if insured get his car fixed and the insurer will send a letter of demand.
Now this can take up to 12 months to arrive so don't just forget about it entirley. Talk to his insurer/solicitor or agent. Insist due to his actions afterward its a middle man you talk to. He/they will be asking for a 100% cost of repairs. What you need to do is direct them to the owner of the vehicle.

I would at a guess then state he will throw it back to your daughter.
At this point and not before hand i would then talk to the third party's insurer and offer a 50/50 settlement for cost of repairs. 50% your daughter 50% the owner. Now if you pay her 50% that gets them off you back and in any court proceedings against your daughter will look fair and reasonable and make the owner look like a total *******, that will get the other 50% awarded against him.

That is the best way to minimise your loss in a legal way.

With the 100 % of cost of repairs, make sure you get the itemised tax invoices so you can further reduce what you have to pay.
For example if the repairer asks for deliver charges, you don not have to pay that, thier loss assessor should have already deleted that from any authorised repair, look for double ups of items, (another trick repairers often do) Towing charges, do NOT pay for storage as the tow company has no authority to do so.

Injury charges forget them........CTP will cover that, not your concern other than maybe providing a statement of what happened.

Any hire car costs....
Make him PROVE demmuarge has occured.
eg can not get to work without travelling over 2 hours on public transport,
uses his vehicle as part of his living. If its just inconvience, do not pay that portion. If he takes the matter to court and be unable to prove demmauage he will lose anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauljh74

That pain in her neck from when he grabbed her just won't go away.

DO NOT DO THIS. If you want to look credible in any legal proceedings against your daughter you don't need this kind of stuff.

pauljh74 · 04-12-2006, 10:40 PM

Paying for the car is pretty clear cut, but I would fight against any injury payments - the first few hundred or whatever is usually paid for by the at fault party, the rest by the roads authority (TAC in Vic). He can't be injured from the accident if he leapt out and attacked your daughter. You could even argue that is what caused it. Your daughter could claim she was injured when attacked even. That pain in her neck from when he grabbed her just won't go away.

**Polyal** · 04-12-2006, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauljh74

That pain in her neck from when he grabbed her just won't go away.

Not to mention the mental anguish.

:

WRP11 · 04-12-2006, 10:50 PM

I'm very ok with the boyfriend not being the boyfriend after this, what sane person would let a 17 year old drive their car in a major downpour anyway, I put that to him already, he just shrugged his stupid shoulders.
Im going to print all this advise off, its good and I will follow it..
The injury thing... I draw the line right there... he was not injured and I will fight that one for her, the witness is solid, so thats a huge bonus.... and yes, she does have a niggle in her neck

right where he grabbed her...

WRP11 · 04-12-2006, 10:54 PM

well YAW it would appear you are up to speed on this... thanks everyone

Sourbastard · 04-12-2006, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WRP11

I'm very ok with the boyfriend not being the boyfriend after this, what sane person would let a 17 year old drive their car in a major downpour anyway, I put that to him already, he just shrugged his stupid shoulders.

After you have seen a lawyer, have someone large beat some sense into her boyfriend. Maybe hire a large violent lawyer to reduce costs.

NA XR6 · 04-12-2006, 11:03 PM

Charge him with assault

vectra-racer · 04-12-2006, 11:42 PM

also try to think of it from the other drivers point of view, i know its difficult.

he's just been hit at speed on the motorway by a car spinning round in a downpour.
no doubt he absolutely shit himself and was so scared and glad to be alive that he forgot himself for a moment.

in no way am i excusing his behaviour [ive been run into twice within 2 weeks [i'd only had her back from the paintshop 3 days the second time] and i managed to stay calm, but they were not life threatening crashes.

adrenaline makes people silly sometimes.

maybe you should talk to the guy, but be reasonable not threatening and hear what he has to say about it now he's calmed down.

then come back and tell us.

Full Spectrum · 04-12-2006, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WRP11

Yesterday evening my 17 year old daughter, (whom is licensed, and completed a defensive driving course at Mt cotton,) was driving her boyfriends vl commodore north bound in the far left lane on the M1 near the hyperdome in Brisbane, it was absolutely belting down with rain and had been for about half an hour and the roads were pooled up and very deep and dangerous in alot of areas, yes, she lost control of the car and spun end for end, she clipped the left rear of another commodore wagon and ended up facing the wrong way down an on ramp, a witness says they were only doing about 70 because of the rain. The other driver pulled up quite a way up the road so my daughter got out and ran to see if they were ok, the driver of the other car lept out when he saw her aproaching his window, he launched at her, grabbed her by the collar with the intention to hurt her, the witness had pulled over and saw what was happening and sat on her horn which stopped him, the witness then told my daughter to get in her car and they proceeded to drive to the nearest police station. The police were fabulous, they bought her back to the scene and calmed this guy down (sort-of), by then I had arrived to rescue my baby, and I got the details of the other driver off the police, they wouldnt let me near him either because he wasn't approachable. Next thing an ambulance arrived, apparently that other driver had called it, he had some sort of injury all of a sudden... well, thats all very clear, my daughter screwed up, the police agree it could happen to anybody so I'm not being too hard on her, but now I have inherrited a serious bunch of bills, so, if it were you, what would you do? Because she is 17 and a full time student do you think his insurance company would do her anyway?, or would it automatically come to me? The boyfriend has no insurance, not even 3rd party.. she has insurance if shes driving HER car.
If the guy had been a bit more normal about the whole thing, re attacking her and injury which he absolutely didn't have prior to the ambulance arriving, I would be more forthcoming, I'd love to hear some comments on this, for and against....

regards
Jude

:

Lie play dumb blame him

He is a **** anyway seem too be nothing wrong with him when he attacked your daughter, She was well within her right too defend herself and she could have gave him a shot in the lower region she was threaten and feared for her life she could have responded, Remember that one for the future;) When attacked you can defend yourself with force.

WRP11 · 05-12-2006, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vectra-racer

also try to think of it from the other drivers point of view, i know its difficult.

he's just been hit at speed on the motorway by a car spinning round in a downpour.
no doubt he absolutely shit himself and was so scared and glad to be alive that he forgot himself for a moment.

in no way am i excusing his behaviour [ive been run into twice within 2 weeks [i'd only had her back from the paintshop 3 days the second time] and i managed to stay calm, but they were not life threatening crashes.

adrenaline makes people silly sometimes.

maybe you should talk to the guy, but be reasonable not threatening and hear what he has to say about it now he's calmed down.

then come back and tell us.

Yea I did do the 'his shoes' thing, I would be cut too, very cut, but not cut enough that i'd grab a young girl around the throat and god knows what else if that witness hadn't sat on her horn allerting him that he was being watched, I would like to think that he can look at it now and regret what he did, like he was never young, never made a mistake, pick me!
I guess the other underlying thing that bothers me, spending my money on fixing a commodore.... ouch....

:
regards
Jude

Interceptor · 05-12-2006, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NA XR6

Charge him with assault

bingo

the spineless twit assaulted your daughter, he might not have punched her, or anything like that, but he touched her, and in a way that was offensive and threatening, so if the ****** decides that his newly discovered injuries are worth sending you a bill for, see if he thinks they're worth a criminal record

BeStRaFe · 05-12-2006, 05:02 AM

i had a similar incedent when living in sydney happen to me.

a lady driving a BMW (who the **** drives a bmw without full comp)
and only had a greenslip, annilated my SC400 Lexus.

my insurance company orgainsed everything to do with the repairs of the vehicle
and just issued the lady with a letter of demand.

to try and get out of paying this (3 months after the incidend) she alleged that i indicated i was turning left at the roudabout not coming straight throug (cmon i was barreling at 60 through the roundabout u think she would have seen (it was obvious from the lipstick streek she was otherwise pre occupied!!!!!!!!!!)

the vehicle was written off and she now has a debt of 24,000+ paying off a smashed 12 year old vehicle

now with the assult, best option is see a doctor. get a written statement from the doctor and all witnesses involved and make a civil suit for assult against him.
he will get a gbh occasioning injury charge and also will be liable for damages in regards to any medical expences and mental anguish if you so choose to go that far.

regarding his "allejed" injuries, thats why you always have 3rd party personal built into your greenslip

regarding the damage to his car.
if you are forced to pay for it...
you can decided to do it "outside" the relm of his insurere.
get multible quotes and lots of pictures BEFORE ANY REPAIRS ARE UNDETAKEN.

GXL078 · 05-12-2006, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NA XR6

Charge him with assault

Do that FIRST, then negotiate with him. He will bend over backwards to get off the charges.
You should just let her go through with it. You are not financially responsible. There should be a compensation fund for uninsured drivers, let them pay the other guy.
Being a minor and female the law will be on her side. But its HIS word against HERS. Did he have any witnesses?
It wasn't her car anyway, the bf should be responsible. Call in Judge Judy, she will give the bf a talking to.

WRP11 · 08-12-2006, 09:32 PM

Well, 5 days later and taking into account all the good advice Ive gotten, Ive decided to hunt him down and.........

seriously though, I agree the boyfriend is liable for half, he asked her / let her drive, he actually accepted that without a flinch.

We received the paper work to fill out from his insurer, just asking who owns the vehicle she was driving, was it insured, and if we are lodging a claim, those I don't mind answering, but then they ask if she accepts responsibility for the damages... well yes, but we havent viewed the car, couldnt at the time of the accident cos the dude was violent, she remembers looking down the side of his car to see what she had done as she was approaching it to see if they were ok, shes very sure there was a big white scrape starting up near the front passenger door going all the way back to what she believes is the damage she did on the back part of the wagon in deep red paint, then of course all hell broke loose,
It says we have 14 days to get back to them, so Ill use all that.

I'm very ok with paying for the repairs, as long as they are genuine..

and on a lighter note...

GO CRAIG

Auslandau · 08-12-2006, 09:45 PM

Good luck with it all! I know its a horrible situation to be in with boy friends, daughters, uninsured car and all sorts of other stuff to work out. One thing is I have never admitted liability on those insurance forms. As discribed, youcan plead a bit ignorant. I have left it up to see how things go........ I rear ended a car once, fairly straight forward, it went to court (through the insurance companies) and I ended up with 20% blame. Other bloke pulled in front of me and stopped. Usually 100% for the one who does the ramming!

I feel for you....I have an 18 year old and have told him that never drive anyone elses car for any reason. 1) insurance on the car....they can say its OK but find out very quickly its not and 2) things can just go wrong. No blame on your part.....unfortunatley the boy friend shouldnt have let her drive an un insured car.....easy in hind sight I know.

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BENT_8 · 09-12-2006, 11:44 AM

Perhaps you should send the other guy a letter of demand in regards to the $2000 worth of improvements your daughter did to his Commodore.
Or better still offer to give him $500 for the wreck and he should feel more than compensated.

WRP11 · 09-12-2006, 01:25 PM

:thebirds: Now thats ^^^ a great idea !!

XR6TickfordBoy · 09-12-2006, 03:10 PM

As it sounds looks like if he was stupid enough to have no insurance then it's falling on u! All I know is when I had an accident in my mum's car which I wasn't insured for, I was allowed to claim under her name and just pay the excess! Don't know if that is relevant at all! Ur daughter really shouldn't be driving an un-insured car, it's just asking for trouble!

GT290 · 09-12-2006, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NA XR6

Charge him with assault

Eactly, that bugger that grabbed your daughter has assulted her and she could charge him and this would look bad for his case of suposed injury to himself. fight fire with fire on this one and hope he will back off with his persuing you or your girl. good luck any way.