nz to allow whaling

burnz · 02-04-2010, 12:40 PM

i simply dont understand their position to allow this

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...section=justin

Quote:

The Federal Government says it is very concerned by New Zealand's compromise proposal with Japan to allow a set number of whales to be killed.

New Zealand has agreed to a plan that would give whaling countries the right to kill 1,500 whales a year, and its whaling commissioner plans to put forward the proposal at international talks in June.

**DJR-351** · 02-04-2010, 12:57 PM

Somebody's been greasing a few palms.....

**Polyal** · 02-04-2010, 01:25 PM

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

MAGPIE · 02-04-2010, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

Shows how much you know, they are not big fish they are mammals

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

why support a moron that drove a freakn awesome boat into the path of a much bigger heavier fishing boat, then boarded a foreign registered vessel illegally, which im pretty sure is still regarded as piracy...

if he did that off the coast off somalia he would have been shot on sight.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Shows how much you know, they are not big fish they are mammals

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

Yep they are mammals.

Just like cows and sheep and pigs and goats etc.

Or is that different?

**Polyal** · 02-04-2010, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Shows how much you know, they are not big fish they are mammals

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

Ah was it the sheepies comment?

Fish/mammal whatever, I dont like the fact that the Japanese seem to not care about the laws and continue, thats not right.

But whaling has been around for a very long time, just like other forms of hunting etc and like I said, unless the ANIMAL is endangered whats the problem?

Just because we dont understand the lust for the meat doesn't mean we have the right to stop it.

Imagine if all the other forms of slaughter got as much air time as this, cows would run the world!

XR8putts · 02-04-2010, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Please.

Pete Bethune has only pulled this stunt to try and make people forget he killed a fisherman (or was it two?) whilst speeding around in his boat trying to set a new world record. The man is a killer.

As a proud Kiwi, I hope the Japanese lock him up an throw away the key.

There is a reason the government won't step in, because he is clearly in the wrong. He should have persued legal avenues and protest, not taken a weapon and illegally tresspassed onto other people's property in the middle of the ocean.

On the issue at hand, I like whales and wish no one wanted to hunt them. However there are nations out there that just see them as food, like we see cows. The people of India don't eat cows, you don't see them telling us not to eat them do you.

It's an unfortunate situation, but the only one breaking laws are the ones anti-whaling 'protestors'.

Our government is pushing for a comprimise, which is far from ideal but they believe the 'ban all whaling' approach has failed over and over. I say good on them fro trying something different.

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

got it one... its just fishing, people need to open their eyes a little and be more concerned about stuff thats going on right in their backyard...

**Falcon Coupe** · 02-04-2010, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

Not exactly, whales are mammals.
They can be trained and interact with humans, unlike fish.

Franco Cozzo · 02-04-2010, 01:32 PM

Japanese are really smart people, I'm sure they can come up with some method of farming whales

**Polyal** · 02-04-2010, 02:21 PM

OK for the record, I dont care how they are defined; nor their intelligence. If it has gills, fins and can breathe underwater its a bloody fish, or fishlike animal.:thebirds:

Perhaps there is a bigger issue here?

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

OK for the record, I dont care how they are defined; nor their intelligence. If it has gills, fins and can breathe underwater its a bloody fish, or fishlike animal.:thebirds:

Perhaps there is a bigger issue here?

they dont breathe underwater... but i agree with you, as far as this conversation is concerned, theyre just a big stinky fish

**DJR-351** · 02-04-2010, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

OK for the record, I dont care how they are defined; nor their intelligence. If it has gills, fins and can breathe underwater its a bloody fish, or fishlike animal.:thebirds:

they don't have gill's and cannot breath under water, one outa three's not bad tho

GS608 · 02-04-2010, 02:25 PM

So how is whale hunting any different from breeding cows just to kill them for their meat? or culling kangaroos cause there are too many of them?

like polyal said, if they're endangered then fair enough.

burnz · 02-04-2010, 03:19 PM

cows are breed for human consuption.
roo's/crocks are plentifull.

whale's were plentifull (1930's) no so today due to over fishing, it is estemated less than plentifull stock of each species.

http://iwcoffice.org/conservation/estimate.htm

flappist · 02-04-2010, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

cows are breed for human consuption.
roo's/crocks are plentifull.

whale's were plentifull (1930's) no so today due to over fishing, it is estemated less than plentifull stock of each species.

http://iwcoffice.org/conservation/estimate.htm

So what you are saying is that you support whale farms to breed them for human consumption?

This is really an emotional argument that will, I suspect, get very ugly.

The anti whale hunters are absolutely sure that they are right and all "normal people" support their position. They have to support you, it only makes sense doesn't it. Anyone who disagrees is just less than human.

But then again I suspect the anti westerners who crashed the aircraft into the twin towers were absolutely sure that they were right and all "normal people" supported their position......

Just because you think something is right or wrong does not make it absolutely true. They are not your whales and this is not your planet. We have to share everything.

The Sea Shepherd terrorists are just very bloody lucky that the Japanese Navy has not sunk them yet. If it were US/Russian/North Korean/Chinese/French/just about every other large nation's fishing ships that were being attacked by pirates the response would be decisive and swift.

And for the record I do not support whaling but also do not support forcing my values and beliefs on others (or others forcing theirs on me).

MAGPIE · 02-04-2010, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

So what you are saying is that you support whale farms to breed them for human consumption?

This is really an emotional argument that will, I suspect, get very ugly.

The anti whale hunters are absolutely sure that they are right and all "normal people" support their position. They have to support you, it only makes sense doesn't it. Anyone who disagrees is just less than human.

But then again I suspect the anti westerners who crashed the aircraft into the twin towers were absolutely sure that they were right and all "normal people" supported their position......

Just because you think something is right or wrong does not make it absolutely true. They are not your whales and this is not your planet. We have to share everything.

The Sea Shepherd terrorists are just very bloody lucky that the Japanese Navy has not sunk them yet. If it were US/Russian/North Korean/Chinese/French/just about every other large nation's fishing ships that were being attacked by pirates the response would be decisive and swift.

And for the record I do not support whaling but also do not support forcing my values and beliefs on others.

They don't need the Jap Navy to sink them, the whaling ships do it themselves !

Without any repercussions I might add.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

They don't need the Jap Navy to sink them, the whaling ships do it themselves !

Without any repercussions I might add.

As they should.

If someone started annoying you as you went about your perfectly legal business because they did not like you e.g. a group of holden bogans harassing you while you were out in your ford and kept following you around getting in your way and generally giving you the poos because they do not like fords would you just accept it?

Or do something about it.........

MAGPIE · 02-04-2010, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

As they should.

If someone started annoying you as you went about your perfectly legal business because they did not like you e.g. a group of holden bogans harassing you while you were out in your ford and kept following you around getting in your way and generally giving you the poos because they do not like fords would you just accept it?

Or do something about it.........

Like committing an illegal act

:

Riksta · 02-04-2010, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

do not support forcing my values and beliefs on others (or others forcing theirs on me).

I just think its very unfortunate not everyone thinks the same way.

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

They are not your whales and this is not your planet. We have to share everything.

.

incorrect

we are the dominant species, it is our planet and they are our whales.

if it isnt ours whos is it?

if the japanese want to eat them go for it i say, many different cultures eat many things we would find abhorrent, dosnt make it wrong, just different.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nstg8a

incorrect

we are the dominant species, it is our planet and they are our whales.

if it isnt ours whos is it?

if the japanese want to eat them go for it i say, many different cultures eat many things we would find abhorrent, dosnt make it wrong, just different.

I meant share with other humans, as in other societies.

ryanstev · 02-04-2010, 03:54 PM

How long have we been trying to ban whaling? Hasn't worked, has it?
NZ is trying to compromise and I think it's well past time to try this.

Japan is a very proud nation, giving up on something is dishonourable.
Can you imagine them ever giving in to those dirty hippies on the boat?

The way to make Japan give up their whaling is to make them decide to give up on their own volition. A compromise like NZ is proposing is a step in that direction.

Adamz Ghia · 02-04-2010, 04:59 PM

One thing people have missed. They are doing it in our waters. So yes, according to our laws, they are doing the wrong thing and we have every right to defend this trritory. As for the comment regarding the Japanese navy sinking the conservation ships, the Japanese are damned lucky we are too weak to send ours down there.

We have staked our claim to these under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, to which Japan has signed up to.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

One thing people have missed. They are doing it in our waters. So yes, according to our laws, they are doing the wrong thing and we have every right to defend this trritory. As for the comment regarding the Japanese navy sinking the conservation ships, the Japanese are damned lucky we are too weak to send ours down there.

We have staked our claim to these under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, to which Japan has signed up to.

Maybe we don't want to be seen to be aiding terrorists and wish to use the correct legal channels.

We have laid claim huh?

Like Saddam Hussain laid claim to Kuwait or Stalin laid claim to most of Western Asia or China laid claim to Tibet?

That sort of claim?

**DJM83** · 02-04-2010, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Maybe we don't want to be seen to be aiding terrorists and wish to use the correct legal channels.

We have laid claim huh?

Like Saddam Hussain laid claim to Kuwait or Stalin laid claim to most of Western Asia or China laid claim to Tibet?

That sort of claim?

Good discussion yes, but lets not turn this into a political discussion please.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

Good discussion yes, but lets not turn this into a political discussion please.

Yes true Dallas but the point I was making was just because someone says they have laid claim to somewhere does not automatically make their claim valid or even indisputable.

The ONLY difference between a terrorist and a freedom fighter is which side of the fence you are seeing them from......

Adamz Ghia · 04-04-2010, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Maybe we don't want to be seen to be aiding terrorists and wish to use the correct legal channels.

We have laid claim huh?

Like Saddam Hussain laid claim to Kuwait or Stalin laid claim to most of Western Asia or China laid claim to Tibet?

That sort of claim?

You're comparing a dictator who murdered hundreds of thousands to a country that has legally laid claim to territory...? Under the UN, our claim is recognised. Whether you chose to agree is irrellevant. Japan has signed up to the same treaty as we have, and are flouting it.

And what legal channels have we used? If the government stood up for our country we wouldn't need these 'terrorists' you speak of.

flappist · 04-04-2010, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

You're comparing a dictator who murdered hundreds of thousands to a country that has legally laid claim to territory...? Under the UN, our claim is recognised. Whether you chose to agree is irrellevant. Japan has signed up to the same treaty as we have, and are flouting it.

And what legal channels have we used? If the government stood up for our country we wouldn't need these 'terrorists' you speak of.

There is only one country in the last 200 years that has ACTUALLY committed genocide.

So before you denounce others ask a Tasmanian Aborigine for his/her opinion.......