What do FPV's have over HSV's?

[XR6Naranja]

Was just checking out the HSV's, nope I'm no traitor..

But looks like Aussie cars are finally stepping it up.

Touch screen control over the car, reverse sensors, blind spots everything, what's the latest FPV's offering that HSV's have incorporated or don't have, because last I checked they haven't advanced all that much.

[onfire]

An absolutely blistering SC Miami V8....

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by onfire

An absolutely blistering SC Miami V8....

yep, a little bit of envy for having a supercharger.

[FreddyDUZ747]

Give me 320rwkws over gadgets every day of the week.

holden man here btw

[Bucknaked]

Originally Posted by FreddyDUZ747

Give me 320rwkws over gadgets every day of the week.

I'm the opposite. I prefer the luxury aspect over the power. I like to get around in comfort. Stock, these cars do a great job. If I want real power and real thrills, I'll get myself onto a litre sportbike.

[jimmyxr6t04]

I've just gone through this dilemma myself... My options at this point in time were limited to the current GS in the FPV range. For the same sort of money i got myself a series 2 WM CapriceV. I had to toss up between sheer power and grunt, or a nice cruiser. I chose the Caprice this time around due to all the extras, and the GS felt too much like an XR.

Really enjoying the Caprice though, enough grunt and sheer luxury. Love the LWB too. I'll lower it, twin 3" exhaust and enjoy the drive.

In two years time, i'll probably opt for the GT, tune it and enjoy the grunt!

[Grunter]

After driving a E3 GTS for the last two week, only the FPV engines and looks are winners over the what the GTS offers. Features and handling (in stock form anyways), the GTS has it over all the current FPV's IMO.

Would I buy a GTS? Nope. Just can't get past the exterior look of them.

[DallasXR6]

Originally Posted by Grunter

Would I buy a GTS? Nope. Just can't get past the exterior look of them.

I hate the drls, and if I had the money would go a gte so it could hide a little.

On that note tho, I also hate the new look falcons, why go euro styled?
When the time comes that I could afford a fpv, if the trend of heading toward euro comes thru, ill be looking for second hand in the current crop

[pottery beige]

GT badge nuff said......

[SLVR GT]

Originally Posted by pottery beige

GT badge nuff said......

[jay289]

No try hard Chevy badges!

[Resurrection]

Awesome exhaust note.

[Cheech]

well if we're talking about power..... the title should be what do ford xr6t have over HSV's ? (Walky excluded) ha ha ha.

[jpd80]

It would be naive to think that HSV won't be back with a Blown V8 to put Miami in the shade.
Their fans want the power and torque that FPV has and will be lining up to pay...

[DallasXR6]

Originally Posted by jpd80

It would be naive to think that HSV won't be back with a Blown V8 to put Miami in the shade.
Their fans want the power and torque that FPV has and will be lining up to pay...

I belive that the hsv petrol heads are more numerous and yell much louder than the fpv camp.. Specialy the younger gen, there are alot more commo fans looking for big power numbers just have a look thru street commodores forums..

[Windsor220]

Originally Posted by jpd80

It would be naive to think that HSV won't be back with a Blown V8 to put Miami in the shade.
Their fans want the power and torque that FPV has and will be lining up to pay...

They better hurry up and get it out. They dont have long left.

[BadMax]

Nothing, both a pretty **** poor efforts. If you combined the best of the two, you'd have a pretty awesome saloon car.

[b2tf]

Stripes?

[Cúl-Báire]

In my opinion, both Holden (HSV) and Ford (Tickford/FPV) haven't really had a "special" car since the HSV VTI/VTII GTS OR (SV300), and TE/TS T3's. These cars were built in "limited" numbers, and significantly different mechanicly to what mum drove the kids to school in. They were the weekend "muscle cars" of their era, and something that is lacking these days.

There is nothing unique about owning an E3 GTS build number 23,451, nor is there about owning BF GT 2344, I reckon I see atleast 10 GTS's and 5 GT's on my trip to work every day...

Thats not to say they aren't great cars, they just aren't that "special" any more.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Cúl-Báire

In my opinion, both Holden (HSV) and Ford (Tickford/FPV) haven't really had a "special" car since the HSV VTI/VTII GTS OR (SV300), and TE/TS T3's. These cars were built in "limited" numbers, and significantly different mechanicly to what mum drove the kids to school in. They were the weekend "muscle cars" of their era, and something that is lacking these days.

There is nothing unique about owning an E3 GTS build number 23,451, nor is there about owning BF GT 2344, I reckon I see atleast 10 GTS's and 5 GT's on my trip to work every day...

Thats not to say they aren't great cars, they just aren't that "special" any more.

So it needs to be 'Special' as in how ....... slow, old and/or crappy ......

Might be an opinion but owning one is way more 'special' than anything else I have owned .... really ...... FORD/FPV bring out what everyone seemed to have wanted and is still not good enough, especially when you compare a GT 335 to a VT/HSV of any sort ...... and that is the topic at hand really

How is the number sold deciding what is more special?

Love the T series but were they limited in sales???? Did they only release a certain amount or did they just sell less than a GT???

But then that's just my opinion owning and driving one everyday .... best damn car I have owned ...... and I've had a few

[dkpioe]

[quote=Auslandau especially when you compare a GT 335 to a VT/HSV of any sort [/quote]

why are you comparing a new fpv to a 1999 VT?

from tests i have seen, the gt335 doesnt have anything over a latest hsv. neck and neck in most test, maybe a few extra kilowatts for the falcon (at maximum revs - but inconsistent with each tested ford, some have less the 335).

at maximum power the cars are neck and neck in most tests, yet the holden has a more desirable image to most people(unless you are a die-die-diehard ford fan - of which there are less and less these days because people have realised their are better and more desirable cars)

why would people prefer a 'superchared v8' over a highly efficient v8 that doesnt need forced induction that weighs the same or less, gives the same or less fuel economy, has a proven record or reliability and gives similar power outputs and is in a more stylish, more desirable to the public - car?

Holden has been such a winner in the v8 war in australia for so long because the chev v8 is so great! it is amazing how little is weighs for the engine capacity it has. the 6.2 litre engine weighs less then a 6 cyl bmw engine half its capacity from the 90s and has twice as much power and heaps more torque and all useable so low in the rev range. and similar fuel economy!
the ford probably has that too, but they are so late to the plate, after using the 5.4l motor for far too long . which had a heavy image to it, search it on youtube and all you find is pickup trucks, a lot of people in australia saw it for what it was, as an agricultural engine - built primarily for farmers pickup trucks. That was Fords fault, and they spent far too many years before replacing it.


The new Fords 335 engine, the public doesnt really know if it is better or worse or if the fuel economy is better or worse, or if it has heaps of torque like the more known holden chev engines, because for one reason - FORD ARE TERRIBLE AT PROMOTION. they really are ****, they are their own worst nightmare, they are behind the eightball in everything.
-the supercharged v8
-the ecolpi-
-the diesel territory
-the 4 cyl falcon
all WAY WAY TOO LATE!
none of which will make any significant sales for ford australia, and at no time do the majority public realise if they are released. has the 4 cyl falcon been released yet? i dont know, i heard it should have been by now, but i havent seen anywhere in any media if it has.

with the new v8, instead of giving any real engine comparisons to holdens chev motors, all the public was given in australia for 2 years was 2 codewords "coyote" and "supercharged". coyote means nothing to anyone, and supercharged has the same conotation for aussie car buyers as turbocharged - meaning it will have less engine capacity, and aussie performance drivers are similar to Americans, they want CUBES - so the wile e. coyote was doomed for bad sales in australia versus a "CHEV" which links the american redneck culture to the aussie bogan culture. both have the mentality of more engine cubes is better.

I believe Ford sales would have gone up if they released a light all alloy fast revving 6.5litre falcon or FPV. this coyote crap is doomed as is everything else lately for ford australia, they do not know what sells, and they do not know how to sell it.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by dkpioe

why are you comparing a new fpv to a 1999 VT?

from tests i have seen, the gt335 doesnt have anything over a latest hsv. neck and neck in most test, maybe a few extra kilowatts for the falcon (at maximum revs - but inconsistent with each tested ford, some have less the 335).

at maximum power the cars are neck and neck in most tests, yet the holden has a more desirable image to most people(unless you are a die-die-diehard ford fan - of which there are less and less these days because people have realised their are better and more desirable cars)

why would people prefer a 'superchared v8' over a highly efficient v8 that doesnt need forced induction that weighs the same or less, gives the same or less fuel economy, has a proven record or reliability and gives similar power outputs and is in a more stylish, more desirable to the public - car?

Holden has been such a winner in the v8 war in australia for so long because the chev v8 is so great! it is amazing how little is weighs for the engine capacity it has. the 6.2 litre engine weighs less then a 6 cyl bmw engine half its capacity from the 90s and has twice as much power and heaps more torque and all useable so low in the rev range. and similar fuel economy!
the ford probably has that too, but they are so late to the plate, after using the 5.4l motor for far too long . which had a heavy image to it, search it on youtube and all you find is pickup trucks, a lot of people in australia saw it for what it was, as an agricultural engine - built primarily for farmers pickup trucks. That was Fords fault, and they spent far too many years before replacing it.


The new Fords 335 engine, the public doesnt really know if it is better or worse or if the fuel economy is better or worse, or if it has heaps of torque like the more known holden chev engines, because for one reason - FORD ARE TERRIBLE AT PROMOTION. they really are ****, they are their own worst nightmare, they are behind the eightball in everything.
-the supercharged v8
-the ecolpi-
-the diesel territory
-the 4 cyl falcon
all WAY WAY TOO LATE!
none of which will make any significant sales for ford australia, and at no time do the majority public realise if they are released. has the 4 cyl falcon been released yet? i dont know, i heard it should have been by now, but i havent seen anywhere in any media if it has.

with the new v8, instead of giving any real engine comparisons to holdens chev motors, all the public was given in australia for 2 years was 2 codewords "coyote" and "supercharged". coyote means nothing to anyone, and supercharged has the same conotation for aussie car buyers as turbocharged - meaning it will have less engine capacity, and aussie performance drivers are similar to Americans, they want CUBES - so the wile e. coyote was doomed for bad sales in australia versus a "CHEV" which links the american redneck culture to the aussie bogan culture. both have the mentality of more engine cubes is better.

I believe Ford sales would have gone up if they released a light all alloy fast revving 6.5litre falcon or FPV. this coyote crap is doomed as is everything else lately for ford australia, they do not know what sells, and they do not know how to sell it.

[theboxmike]

Originally Posted by dkpioe

why are you comparing a new fpv to a 1999 VT?

from tests i have seen, the gt335 doesnt have anything over a latest hsv. neck and neck in most test, maybe a few extra kilowatts for the falcon (at maximum revs - but inconsistent with each tested ford, some have less the 335).

at maximum power the cars are neck and neck in most tests, yet the holden has a more desirable image to most people(unless you are a die-die-diehard ford fan - of which there are less and less these days because people have realised their are better and more desirable cars)

why would people prefer a 'superchared v8' over a highly efficient v8 that doesnt need forced induction that weighs the same or less, gives the same or less fuel economy, has a proven record or reliability and gives similar power outputs and is in a more stylish, more desirable to the public - car?

Holden has been such a winner in the v8 war in australia for so long because the chev v8 is so great! it is amazing how little is weighs for the engine capacity it has. the 6.2 litre engine weighs less then a 6 cyl bmw engine half its capacity from the 90s and has twice as much power and heaps more torque and all useable so low in the rev range. and similar fuel economy!
the ford probably has that too, but they are so late to the plate, after using the 5.4l motor for far too long . which had a heavy image to it, search it on youtube and all you find is pickup trucks, a lot of people in australia saw it for what it was, as an agricultural engine - built primarily for farmers pickup trucks. That was Fords fault, and they spent far too many years before replacing it.


The new Fords 335 engine, the public doesnt really know if it is better or worse or if the fuel economy is better or worse, or if it has heaps of torque like the more known holden chev engines, because for one reason - FORD ARE TERRIBLE AT PROMOTION. they really are ****, they are their own worst nightmare, they are behind the eightball in everything.
-the supercharged v8
-the ecolpi-
-the diesel territory
-the 4 cyl falcon
all WAY WAY TOO LATE!
none of which will make any significant sales for ford australia, and at no time do the majority public realise if they are released. has the 4 cyl falcon been released yet? i dont know, i heard it should have been by now, but i havent seen anywhere in any media if it has.

with the new v8, instead of giving any real engine comparisons to holdens chev motors, all the public was given in australia for 2 years was 2 codewords "coyote" and "supercharged". coyote means nothing to anyone, and supercharged has the same conotation for aussie car buyers as turbocharged - meaning it will have less engine capacity, and aussie performance drivers are similar to Americans, they want CUBES - so the wile e. coyote was doomed for bad sales in australia versus a "CHEV" which links the american redneck culture to the aussie bogan culture. both have the mentality of more engine cubes is better.

I believe Ford sales would have gone up if they released a light all alloy fast revving 6.5litre falcon or FPV. this coyote crap is doomed as is everything else lately for ford australia, they do not know what sells, and they do not know how to sell it.

I'm sorry WHAT??

[superpursuit83]

Originally Posted by dkpioe

why are you comparing a new fpv to a 1999 VT?

from tests i have seen, the gt335 doesnt have anything over a latest hsv. neck and neck in most test, maybe a few extra kilowatts for the falcon (at maximum revs - but inconsistent with each tested ford, some have less the 335).

at maximum power the cars are neck and neck in most tests, yet the holden has a more desirable image to most people(unless you are a die-die-diehard ford fan - of which there are less and less these days because people have realised their are better and more desirable cars)

why would people prefer a 'superchared v8' over a highly efficient v8 that doesnt need forced induction that weighs the same or less, gives the same or less fuel economy, has a proven record or reliability and gives similar power outputs and is in a more stylish, more desirable to the public - car?

Holden has been such a winner in the v8 war in australia for so long because the chev v8 is so great! it is amazing how little is weighs for the engine capacity it has. the 6.2 litre engine weighs less then a 6 cyl bmw engine half its capacity from the 90s and has twice as much power and heaps more torque and all useable so low in the rev range. and similar fuel economy!
the ford probably has that too, but they are so late to the plate, after using the 5.4l motor for far too long . which had a heavy image to it, search it on youtube and all you find is pickup trucks, a lot of people in australia saw it for what it was, as an agricultural engine - built primarily for farmers pickup trucks. That was Fords fault, and they spent far too many years before replacing it.


The new Fords 335 engine, the public doesnt really know if it is better or worse or if the fuel economy is better or worse, or if it has heaps of torque like the more known holden chev engines, because for one reason - FORD ARE TERRIBLE AT PROMOTION. they really are ****, they are their own worst nightmare, they are behind the eightball in everything.
-the supercharged v8
-the ecolpi-
-the diesel territory
-the 4 cyl falcon
all WAY WAY TOO LATE!
none of which will make any significant sales for ford australia, and at no time do the majority public realise if they are released. has the 4 cyl falcon been released yet? i dont know, i heard it should have been by now, but i havent seen anywhere in any media if it has.

with the new v8, instead of giving any real engine comparisons to holdens chev motors, all the public was given in australia for 2 years was 2 codewords "coyote" and "supercharged". coyote means nothing to anyone, and supercharged has the same conotation for aussie car buyers as turbocharged - meaning it will have less engine capacity, and aussie performance drivers are similar to Americans, they want CUBES - so the wile e. coyote was doomed for bad sales in australia versus a "CHEV" which links the american redneck culture to the aussie bogan culture. both have the mentality of more engine cubes is better.

I believe Ford sales would have gone up if they released a light all alloy fast revving 6.5litre falcon or FPV. this coyote crap is doomed as is everything else lately for ford australia, they do not know what sells, and they do not know how to sell it.

6.5 Litre!!
I think the climate concious generation would prefer a HSV killing 5.0litre. HSV will follow suit soon enough. The rest of the people just look at the badge and 335 is a nice big number.
Aussie engineers fixed the Boss truck engine and we have great vehicles

The only part of your statement anyone would agree with is Ford are screwing up the marketing.

[anto]

Originally Posted by dkpioe

why are you comparing a new fpv to a 1999 VT?

from tests i have seen, the gt335 doesnt have anything over a latest hsv. neck and neck in most test, maybe a few extra kilowatts for the falcon (at maximum revs - but inconsistent with each tested ford, some have less the 335).

at maximum power the cars are neck and neck in most tests, yet the holden has a more desirable image to most people(unless you are a die-die-diehard ford fan - of which there are less and less these days because people have realised their are better and more desirable cars)

why would people prefer a 'superchared v8' over a highly efficient v8 that doesnt need forced induction that weighs the same or less, gives the same or less fuel economy, has a proven record or reliability and gives similar power outputs and is in a more stylish, more desirable to the public - car?

Holden has been such a winner in the v8 war in australia for so long because the chev v8 is so great! it is amazing how little is weighs for the engine capacity it has. the 6.2 litre engine weighs less then a 6 cyl bmw engine half its capacity from the 90s and has twice as much power and heaps more torque and all useable so low in the rev range. and similar fuel economy!
the ford probably has that too, but they are so late to the plate, after using the 5.4l motor for far too long . which had a heavy image to it, search it on youtube and all you find is pickup trucks, a lot of people in australia saw it for what it was, as an agricultural engine - built primarily for farmers pickup trucks. That was Fords fault, and they spent far too many years before replacing it.


The new Fords 335 engine, the public doesnt really know if it is better or worse or if the fuel economy is better or worse, or if it has heaps of torque like the more known holden chev engines, because for one reason - FORD ARE TERRIBLE AT PROMOTION. they really are ****, they are their own worst nightmare, they are behind the eightball in everything.
-the supercharged v8
-the ecolpi-
-the diesel territory
-the 4 cyl falcon
all WAY WAY TOO LATE!
none of which will make any significant sales for ford australia, and at no time do the majority public realise if they are released. has the 4 cyl falcon been released yet? i dont know, i heard it should have been by now, but i havent seen anywhere in any media if it has.

with the new v8, instead of giving any real engine comparisons to holdens chev motors, all the public was given in australia for 2 years was 2 codewords "coyote" and "supercharged". coyote means nothing to anyone, and supercharged has the same conotation for aussie car buyers as turbocharged - meaning it will have less engine capacity, and aussie performance drivers are similar to Americans, they want CUBES - so the wile e. coyote was doomed for bad sales in australia versus a "CHEV" which links the american redneck culture to the aussie bogan culture. both have the mentality of more engine cubes is better.

I believe Ford sales would have gone up if they released a light all alloy fast revving 6.5litre falcon or FPV. this coyote crap is doomed as is everything else lately for ford australia, they do not know what sells, and they do not know how to sell it.

HSV has it all over FPV in the tupperware department, if thats not important then the GT is what you want.

[onfire]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

How is the number sold deciding what is more special?

Exclusivity.

Which drives the value of an object.

Lets say, instead of building 10,000 cars - FPV build 1000. Well, that makes said vehicle a lot more desirable now doesn't it.

And with those numbers, you could probably put an extra $20,000 on the RRP.

[BadMax]

Originally Posted by onfire

Exclusivity.

Which drives the value of an object.

Lets say, instead of building 10,000 cars - FPV build 1000. Well, that makes said vehicle a lot more desirable now doesn't it.

And with those numbers, you could probably put an extra $20,000 on the RRP.

FPV could produce loads more, it's just that no one wants them or sales would be much higher.

[XR6TCraig]

Originally Posted by onfire

Exclusivity.

.

Lets say, instead of building 10,000 cars - FPV build 1000. Well, that makes said vehicle a lot more desirable now doesn't it.

I suppose it would make them more desirable. Especially when FPV go belly up because they aren't going to survive making just 1000 cars are they? Unless they price them something like a lambo or a ferrari I suppose?

Do you suggest they make 1000 cars of one particular model and then create a new model with similar characteristics but a new name, to protect the exclusivity?

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by onfire

Exclusivity.

Which drives the value of an object.

Lets say, instead of building 10,000 cars - FPV build 1000. Well, that makes said vehicle a lot more desirable now doesn't it.

And with those numbers, you could probably put an extra $20,000 on the RRP.

It makes them unpopular is what it makes them. Everytime I see an FPV ad in the paper is highlighting the massive discounts available on the FPV range.

They are good cars but for a load of complex reasons they just don't have the brand value that HSV has established.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by onfire

Exclusivity.

Which drives the value of an object.

Lets say, instead of building 10,000 cars - FPV build 1000. Well, that makes said vehicle a lot more desirable now doesn't it.

And with those numbers, you could probably put an extra $20,000 on the RRP.

Not if they are crap ...... wouldn't matter if they made 2 of em. People complain that enough isn't sold, others complain they are all too common and see them everyday. I didn't buy it for exclusivity. There are way more cars for the price that I could have bought for that.

On another note ...... can't understand why all the bitterness about FPV. Remember reading so many threads a couple of years ago pre S/C, people wanting a ball tearer, to wipe the smile of HSV. They got one, and now there are so many whinges. Most have no intentions of buying one and would hazzard a guess that many haven't even sat in one, let alone been a passenger, let alone driven one.

It is a Ford forum after all and find some of the comments misguided, naive, boarding on insulting to those that have bought, enjoying and love their cars ..... after all .... that's why we are here on a FORD FORUM discussing what we enjoy. Not listening the absolute ramblings of those that would be more comfortable playing in the LS1 Forums where they can whinge and complain to their little hearts desire. Say these things on their Forums about HSV and see how far you get. I wouldn't for one as I respect what other people have bought and also their passion to a brand.

We have been more than patient here letting people have their opinion ..... no matter how much of it is tripe or insulting. Some people on these Forums need to remind themselves where they are and who they are talking to before bagging out ....... everyone is entitled to an opinion but more care needs to taken where and how this opinion is stated.

Have owned every model since the 70's and going from an AU to BA to FG they just keep improving and I for one wouldn't expect to go from BA to AMGC63 over night on a company that is running (profitably mind you) with minimal resources in a very minimal local market.

Price wise ...... have no problems with the GT .... power wise .... no probs .... no heated seats ..... no probs ..... suspension .... no probs ..... interior ..... no probs ..... bang for buck .... absolutely no probs. Could they improve a few things? Of course but as far as the beloved HSV go? I do not like (Ford Forum, can say that) they are slower, do not like the seats nor interior, are slower, look way to Autobarn spec, are slower and generally am not impressed by the brand ......... HENCE why I parted with my money for one, HENCE why I am on a bloody a FORD Forum. To enjoy what I have and discuss accordingly. NOT to come here everyday and read rubbish from those that have absolutely no interest in anything Ford. Branding yourself an "Auto enthusiast" doesn't give anyone the right to then crap on what others enjoy and neither does starting a sentence with IMHO.

Take your gripes and whinges else where cos I and many others here are absolutey sick of it